Stalled out Sugar wash

[earthbound0729]

Hello all,
earthbound here.
Interesting situation I ran into with current sugar wash. Has not happened before.

Details: 4 gallon total volume, Initial SG was 1.14 (highest I've ever used), using Red Star Dady Yeast 2 grams per gallon and Distiller's Nutrients from Brewhaus; finished off with Sparkolloid from same supplier.

After about a week and a half of cruising along, all apparent yeast activity had stopped with no CO2 being produced x several days--my conclusion, most sugar now converted so time to clear and run.
Interestingly enough, when I checked the SG it was only 1.07- 1.08 measured with 2 different hydrometers. Taste was sweet with good ETOH detected by smell. Might be good if I was doing a
Moscato wine. , but I'm not. I knew I couldn't waste all that sugar in solution.

I immediately ran to momma here and started reading everything I could about my problem. One thing that first caught my eye looking for reasons for a 'Stalled Wash' was too low pH.
I checked the pH with my trusty digital meter and it read 2.9. Back to momma. More Research showed me that my range should be higher, around the mid 4+-5's. Bummer for me, my value for pH was wayyy
too low. What to do now? More Research showed me some common and less common ways to up the pH. Fortunately, one of the ways was to use KOH, AKA potassium hydroxide, which
I just happen to have lying around. I was able to slowly get the ph to a reasonable value.
I re-Yeasted the batch and kind of started from where this wash stalled, but now with a starting ph of 5.4. Hopefully I will be able to finish this run with a proper SG around 0.99.

Now for the more experienced:
1. Should I have started out with such a high SG as 1.14?
2. Maybe used less yeast with such a high starting SG, or maybe a different strain that may tolerate lower pH values?
3. Should I have been more careful to check the pH, adjusting with an alkalizing agent become routine as the wash is progressing, and again referencing question#1? Wasn't something I was expecting, hence question #1. I can't claim total ignorance on chemistry, since I took enough high school and college chemistries to know that CO2 in solution causes an acidic change in the solution, but I didn't realize that this would stall the yeast as they are happily munching away, nor at what level of pH this would occur. Newbies have so much to learn, right?
4. Should I have to readjust the wash pH before doing a run to a more neutral pH, or is where I'm at pH-wise good enough at that point, wherever that falls?

Seems like there must be a happy medium somewhere where volumes, SG, pH, yeast and Acid-Base relationships come together without unduly wasting precious resources we use.

I appreciate any and all who can shed some light on these important questions, including correcting erroneously understood items.
Thank you,
earthbound

[jedneck]

I'd say SG was to high. I shoot for 1.07 max on sugar heads.

[S-Cackalacky]

Calcium Carbonate for adjusting PH. Get it from a brew supply store (Brewhaus). Other sources would be crushed egg shells, sea shells, or Tums antacid tablets. In a pinch you could also use Sodium Bicarbonate (baking soda). Egg shells or sea shells might be a good way to buffer the wash from the beginning. They are dissolved by the acid as the PH goes down.

[earthbound0729]

Thank you both jedneck and S-Cackalacky.

So, would adjusting pH and continuing on with my current wash be suitable using the new yeast and nutrient?

Thanks,
earthbound

[rad14701]

As jedneck stated, your initial SG (OG), and potential %ABV, is way too high... That's 18% - 20%, depending on what the FG were to end up at once all sugar was expended... There is no reason to run such high gravity washes... Think Quality, not Quantity... All else is moot until you get your potential %ABV down by keeping your OG at or under 1.092 (14% ABV)... Kick the greed concept to the curb and you'll be more successful...

[shadylane]

I'd say SG was to high. I shoot for 1.07 max on sugar heads.

jebneck that's a fact.
I feel sorry for yeast trying to survive a ferment with a SG of 1.14 and with little nutrients to eat.
And practical nothing to buffer the pH changes that naturally accrue
Then it would appear the yeast got a dose of Sparkolloid and fell to the bottom of the fermenter before it was done.

No offence meant earthbound but yeast will shit in your wash if it's treated poorly.
4 gallons at 1.14 or 8 gallons at 1.07 produce the same amount of alcohol.
The 1.07 wash will finish faster, cleaner and with less drama.
Posting at the same time as Rad

[earthbound0729]

Hello rad14701 and shadylane, I appreciate your responses and candor, although I have learned more now through this process and these answers.
Unfortunately, the historical information I posted in detail in the initial post has not not been addressed to answer my last question.
My current SG is now 1.07-1.08.

So now I will requote my last question and we can start from there again please.

So, would adjusting pH and continuing on with my current wash be suitable using the new yeast and nutrient?

As an addendum, the initial wash was racked first, of course.

thanks all.
earthbound

[hamshine]

i say dump that shit and make a different wash.... you could fuck with it for a long time trying to get it to finish out, or just wait 5 days for a new way lower SG sugar head to finish.

[blueduck]

Given that youer wash had way to high of a SG you could bring it down by splitting it in two and adding water to it. I would try 1 gal pr half if the new SG is not down to 1.03 add a little more water. I would aerate and ph the new water before adding it. dont forget to stir up the yeast bed before you split the wash.
this worked for me just this summer. I had done a 10 gal wino wash with only 6 gal of water do to a bad calculation. from what you said it sounds like the same error
good luck

[rad14701]

More less what blueduck said... Adjusting the pH of a partially fermented high gravity wash is an act of futility... There is already enough alcohol in the wash to start killing off weaker yeast... You need to dilute the alcohol so that a yeast colony can remain healthy... Whether some bad components have already been created or not is questionable but diluting would also reduce the impact if it has, in fact, happened...

[earthbound0729]

Ok, you all. Thank you for the new info and suggestions.
Chalk this up to experience, and time to start over. By the time I jacked with this, I could have already had a new batch fermenting properly.
Will do my run as is and get whatever I can out of it. No sense wasting good ETOH.

Thanks,
earthbound

[moosemilk]

Leave lots of head room if you are gonna run it as is. That much sugar left is gonna want to foam up and puke on you. Run it slow, and you can always put a bit of olive oil or butter in with it to help from foaming a bit (assuming you won't be using the backset, which you probably wouldn't want to from this batch)

[still_stirrin]

O.P., all is not lost.

I recently had a birdwatchers stall on me early into the ferment. I'd used DAP as nutrients for the sugar wash instead of the T&T which uses tomato paste. I'd thought it was an either/or option. But the yeast started and then stalled.

So, what I did was to start another birdwatchers batch, this time with a good dose of tomato paste. I made the 5 gallon batch the same otherwise. I separated the stalled batch into two fermenters (1/2 full in each). Then I split the new batch (with tomato paste nutrients) and finished filling each of the fermenters. Some of the original yeast innoculation went into both fermenters by the split batch. I hydrated another packet of yeast and split between the two fermenters. Essentially I doubled the batch by dividing and adding.

The new ferment took off with vigorous activity within an hour. It has been driving hard for two days since. I'm confident that it will drive down to terminal this time. Its like a race between the twin tanks, to see which finishes first.

The OG was 1.065 for the initial 5 gallon batch, and 1.062 for the 2nd batch (measured prior to combining with the split batch).

Bottomline...I think the initial problem with the ferment was overcome by the addition of fresh fermentable sweet liquor. And improving the conditions (adding nutrients) to support yeast function helped too. You can adjust ph and reduce high residual sugar content without losing your starting wash.

Divide and conquer!
ss