sweetfeed whisky

[Condensifier]

Yeah, I think KS was using a 6 gallon bucket so add enough water to reach the 6 gallon mark or an inch or so below the top, maybe 1.5 inches.

If you're using a 5 gallon bucket then use the recipe that Tater posted in the second post in the thread.

[S-Cackalacky]

Like KS says near the end of his first post, "It doesn't need to be exact.". I use 5 gallon buckets, so I go with 5 lbs each of sugar and grain and something like 3 to 3.5 gallons of total liquid (water/backset). That brings me to within 2 inches of the top of the bucket. I do 4 buckets which gives me about 3 boiler charges for strips in a 5 gallon boiler. It would also be a good single charge for a 15.5 gallon keg boiler.

[BaxtersDad]

My first batch of sweetfeed will get made up this afternoon. Here is a copy and paste from the edit to the very first post:
-----
So let's break it down here.
You could go 1.5 to 1.75 lbs of sweetfeed and 1.5 to 1.75 lbs of sugar to a gallon of water. With no problems.

Or easier terms. Equal parts sweetfeed and sugar to end up with the SG you want.
-----

So if you run this out, you could use up 9 to 10.5 lbs each of sweetfeed and sugar. I am going with 8 lbs. sweetfeed, 8 lbs. sugar and six gallons of added water, 2 gallons to soak the sweetfeed and mix the sugar, then 4 gallons added to bring total volume up, which I trust will fit in my 8 gallon fermenter! Looking for an OG in the neighborhood of 1.060, which should go to something like a 7.8% wash. Of course it will be lower because this is not sugar in a gallon, it is sugar added to a gallon. No bakers yeast for this boy, using US-05 California Ale Yeast.

6 X 1.5 lbs = 9 lbs
6 x 1.75 lbs = 10.5 lbs

[panikry83]

Started my first generational Sweet Feed (fermented UJSSM style) on Thursday 9/17/2015. Recipe was:

In 20 gallon Brute Container:
8 gallons water
2 gallons Backset
14 lbs COB w/ molasses
12 lbs. white granulated sugar (figured additional 2 lbs would come from the molasses)
1 tbsp Epsom Salts
1 jar Rehydrated Baker's Yeast

Added aquarium thermo @ 86 degrees and let it go while I was out of town. OG = 1.053 / pH = 5.6. Today, Wednesday 7/23/2015, FG = 0.999, tastes very dry, calculated ABV = 7.09%. Racked into secondary fermenter until I get time this week to distill it, and started generation #2. Scraped top 2" off grain bed and added same amount back. Added 8 gallons of water and dissolved 12# sugar in 2 gallons of backset and added it in. Just started the thermo and capped it up. Will check again on Monday or Tuesday.

[The Booze Pipe]

I stirred up a double batch of this sweet feed whiskey this afternoon. I used a half cup of distillers yeast in each fermenter. I didn't see much corn in my mix, but there seemed to be plenty of free extras - stems, cobs, and whatnot. The mash tasted good. I look forward to the outcome.
OG was 1.055, seems a bit low to me, or is it about right? I really don't think the molasses added much gravity, if any.
I'm sorry, but I didn't get to reading all 110 pages of this topic, but I did read or skim a good portion of it.

[S-Cackalacky]

The 1.055 OG isn't too bad. If it ferments out to 1.000, that would give a little over 7% ABV. It's good to shoot for about 1.060 to 1.065, which would give somewhere around 8%. Grain washes seem to benefit from lower gravities. If you kept notes on what you put into your ferment, just up the sugar slightly next time.

With the premixed SF, you get what you get with no guarantees. Sometimes the proportions of the 3 grains will also vary. A lot of members are mixing their own by buying the grains separately. That way you can control the consistency of the recipe and do it the way you like. Most folks like equal weight proportions of each grain and add molasses and/or brown sugar. You can even substitute or add other grains (e.g., wheat, rye, etc.). You can even use the separate grains to put together grain bills for other recipes. Basically gives a lot more flexibility.

Much of this is covered in the recipe thread, but I agree, it's a lot to read. I've been hoping that a Mod would create an abridged version like has been done with a lot of the other recipes.

[The Booze Pipe]

The 1.055 OG isn't too bad. If it ferments out to 1.000, that would give a little over 7% ABV. It's good to shoot for about 1.060 to 1.065, which would give somewhere around 8%. Grain washes seem to benefit from lower gravities. If you kept notes on what you put into your ferment, just up the sugar slightly next time.

Correct me if I am wrong, but this recipe would be considered a thin mash, grain for flavor, sugar for alcohol? Versus the all grain mash, converted starches to sugars for alcohol.
What would be pros and cons of upping the sugar content in a thin mash using high tolerant yeast? Would the high sugar/alcohol content wash out the flavor of the grain? Feel free to direct me to another topic to answer these questions. I apologize for asking elementary questions.

[rad14701]

The 1.055 OG isn't too bad. If it ferments out to 1.000, that would give a little over 7% ABV. It's good to shoot for about 1.060 to 1.065, which would give somewhere around 8%. Grain washes seem to benefit from lower gravities. If you kept notes on what you put into your ferment, just up the sugar slightly next time.

Correct me if I am wrong, but this recipe would be considered a thin mash, grain for flavor, sugar for alcohol? Versus the all grain mash, converted starches to sugars for alcohol.
What would be pros and cons of upping the sugar content in a thin mash using high tolerant yeast? Would the high sugar/alcohol content wash out the flavor of the grain? Feel free to direct me to another topic to answer these questions. I apologize for asking elementary questions.

Yeast tolerance isn't the issue, sugar bite is the reason to stick with a low gravity wash so that the grain flavor is predominant instead of said sugar bite... Plus you're after Quality spirits, not Quantity... It's a balancing act...

[The Booze Pipe]

Yeast tolerance isn't the issue, sugar bite is the reason to stick with a low gravity wash so that the grain flavor is predominant instead of said sugar bite... Plus you're after Quality spirits, not Quantity... It's a balancing act...

Thanks Rad, that was the answer I was looking for. makes sense.

[S-Cackalacky]

The 1.055 OG isn't too bad. If it ferments out to 1.000, that would give a little over 7% ABV. It's good to shoot for about 1.060 to 1.065, which would give somewhere around 8%. Grain washes seem to benefit from lower gravities. If you kept notes on what you put into your ferment, just up the sugar slightly next time.

Correct me if I am wrong, but this recipe would be considered a thin mash, grain for flavor, sugar for alcohol? Versus the all grain mash, converted starches to sugars for alcohol.
What would be pros and cons of upping the sugar content in a thin mash using high tolerant yeast? Would the high sugar/alcohol content wash out the flavor of the grain? Feel free to direct me to another topic to answer these questions. I apologize for asking elementary questions.

I thought it was assumed that we were talking about a sugarhead since that's the recipe. Yes, the more sugar you add, the more bite there will be. The only recipe I can think of that is typically of a higher gravity would be a rum wash - maybe 10 to 12 percent would be typical. Adding sugar to an AG or brandy recipe will also result in an inferior product. With grain based sugarheads, there's a fine balance between gravity and quality of the final product.

[The Booze Pipe]

Thanks for the explanation. I think I'm on the same boat now.

[BaxtersDad]

ADAPTING SWEETFEED WHISKEY FOR SWEETFEED WITH PELLETS!

Today I started my second sweetfeed whiskey fermentation. I have Country Acres sweetfeed, which has pellets. The first batch was less than spectacular, a learning experience. OK, I will get some pellet-free sweetfeed one of these days, but I have what is left of a 50 lb bag of sweetfeed with pellets, so I am going to use it up. Here is what I did today, going to do a second batch tomorrow.

The main problem with sweetfeed with pellets is that it absorbs all the liquid and turn into a porridge mess. Fermenting on the grain is out of the question IMHO What to do? Here is what I did.

I put 7 lbs of sweetfeed into each of two 5 gallon buckets, and added 2.5 gallons of boiling water to each. As expected, the sweetfeed seemed to absorb just about all the boiling water! So after 30 minutes, I added 1 more gallon of hot tap water to each bucket, and immediately strained it using a plastic strainer.

I mashed 5 lbs of malted barley for 30 minutes in 3 gallons of strike water at 160 degrees F, and it settled in at 140 degrees F. I added the runoff to the strained sweetfeed liquor. This made the total volume very close to 6+ gallonsl, and it was at about 1.030. I added about 12 pounds of sugar, and got an SG of about 1.096.

I oxygenated the crap out of my wort with my aquarium pump and sintered stone, and pitched reconstituted 11.5 grams of Safele US-05. We shall see what gives tomorrow!

I think for tomorrow I will up the malted barely, which I hope will allow me to back off the sugar, but I want to keep the SG up above 1.090.

Stay tuned!

[Monkeyman88]

Why do you want to keep the gravity above 1.090?

[S-Cackalacky]

How much did you pay for that bag of pelleted SF that you want to go through that much hassle? Feed it to the wildlife and buy separate grains and molasses and mix your own. And, maybe use those same grains to make some other things.

[BaxtersDad]

We have been round and round about this...I want the wash to be about 12%, greater yield of alcohol. I see no benefit from a lower OG, some agree, some do not. YMMV.

[S-Cackalacky]

I think you would be hard pressed to find more than a handful here who would agree with that.

[Konrad Arflane]

My bet is that this batch is also 'less than spectacular'.

Alfalfa does not a good drink make, no matter where it is in the process...to say nothing about the sugar bite...

[BaxtersDad]

How much did you pay for that bag of pelleted SF that you want to go through that much hassle? Feed it to the wildlife and buy separate grains and molasses and mix your own. And, maybe use those same grains to make some other things.

[BaxtersDad]

My bet is that this batch is also 'less than spectacular'.

Alfalfa does not a good drink make, no matter where it is in the process...to say nothing about the sugar bite...

We shall see what this batch turns out. There is no alfalfa in Country Acres sweetfeed, you are barking up the wrong tree here. Sugar bite may or may not exist, it has been discussed quite a bit before. I have made gin with a 1.095 sugar wash, and it was pretty darn good. YMMV.

[BaxtersDad]

How much did you pay for that bag of pelleted SF that you want to go through that much hassle? Feed it to the wildlife and buy separate grains and molasses and mix your own. And, maybe use those same grains to make some other things.

No big hassle to do the straining actually. I mashed the malted barley because as a homebrewer I can do that easily. I do not have horses, so I will ferment my sweetfeed, thanks!

[Konrad Arflane]

There is no alfalfa in Country Acres sweetfeed, you are barking up the wrong tree here.

So what're the pellets made of?

[BaxtersDad]

I think you would be hard pressed to find more than a handful here who would agree with that.

Here is what Rad had so say about that:

I can't honestly say that I've ever experienced the whole sugar bite issue... Maybe some excess heads or tails during blending but not any sugar bite... Properly blended, my neutral spirits only have the mild sweet taste that is indicative of clean neutral spirits... The spirits aren't actually sweet, it's just how the human brain interprets the taste, or lack thereof, of neutral spirits...

The ~19% washes I mentioned earlier actually distilled out to be some of the most neutral spirits I've produced, but that was due to extended clearing and then stripping before doing the spirit run... What sugar washes can exemplify, however, is a relative lack of mouth feel that some might misconstrue as sugar bite... I guess I've never considered the occasional lack of mouth feel, depending on wash recipe composition, to be an issue... But, then again, I don't usually drink neutral spirits neat - although I have been known to down a shot or two at times...

rad14701
Master Distiller

[BaxtersDad]

There is no alfalfa in Country Acres sweetfeed, you are barking up the wrong tree here.

So what're the pellets made of?

I posted all of the ingredients of Country Acres sweetfeed in another thread:

I pulled the tag off the bag, and the ingredients are wheat middlings, oat hulls,rolled corn, whole oats, cane molasses, canola meal, calcium carbonate, ground barley, soybean oil and salt. Then propionic acid, a bunch of vitamins (E, D3 and A), and some other mineral sounding stuff (zinc oxide, copper sulfate, magnesium oxide, cobalt carbonate, ferrous oxide, sodium selenite and manganous oxide). No alfalpha. I tasted the pellets (yes, I ate the dang horse feed) and they were grainy and sweet. My supposition is that the molasses and some grain were mixed together then pelletized. So I don't see any issue with the pellets. Not so sure about all the minerals, but the wort tasted great and it is fermenting like crazy.

[Konrad Arflane]

Then I hope it turns out awesome.

[HDNB]

I ran your recipe past my stallion. He whinny'd and pawed 3 times.

sez it's a winner, just watch out for all the oils. he sez it'll keep your poop smooth.

[S-Cackalacky]

You realize Rad WAS talking about neutral in a reflux still, right? Anyway, you don't seem to be willing to consider other opinions here, so do what you will - we don't have to drink it.

[Konrad Arflane]

All this recent talk of SF, good or bad, made me realize it was time to start a new ferment. Still have one 4 gal. batch to run, along with the feints from the last run...last of my 4th gen, but I recently acquired a 7.8 gal. ferment bucket with the intent of starting a new 1st gen batch. Boiler is an 8 gal., been doing two 6 gal. ferments which result in a pair of 4 gal. runs...wanted to get that to a single run of about 5-6 or so gal, plus free up the 6's for rum and other things.

Anyway...4 inches of Producers Pride, about 4 gallons of boiling water...let steep for a bit...8 lbs of sugar...stir well. Filled to about 7.5 gal. total with cool water and allowed overall temp to drop to about 90 degrees. Pitched a packet of EC1118 in just under a quart of 104 degree water with a heaping tablespoon sugar added to feed and when happily multiplying, added to new batch, capped and airlocked.

Now to decide whether to use pFrench or Hungarian oak in finishing...

And it really is that simple...'cept for that whole cuts, blending thing.

[BaxtersDad]

I ran your recipe past my stallion. He whinny'd and pawed 3 times.

sez it's a winner, just watch out for all the oils. he sez it'll keep your poop smooth.

I agree, the oils do concern me a bit. Time will tell...

[BaxtersDad]

You realize Rad WAS talking about neutral in a reflux still, right? Anyway, you don't seem to be willing to consider other opinions here, so do what you will - we don't have to drink it.

Correct, I am not constrained by "conventional wisdom," and of course you do not have to drink it.
You are wrong that I do not consider other opinions, I take them for what they are worth.

[Konrad Arflane]

I agree, the oils do concern me a bit. Time will tell...

So, just curious...why waste the time, concern, ifishness, when the tried and true is before you and you have so many reports of excellent results?

Seems rather counter-productive to me. Some might call it a waste of resources and time...albeit, your time to waste...