Using cooler for cooling water reservoir

[Morrey]

I have a 150 quart (37.5 gallon) Igloo cooler that I'd like to use for a closed loop cooling water reservoir instead of allowing outlet water to exhaust on the ground. I plan to use a 260 gph variable output fountain pump with 5/8" line to form the closed loop system.

Will this amount of water heat up quickly when heated water is returned? I can float frozen water bottles in the water to keep cool if suggested, realizing I want to maintain more or less constants temps and not rapid highs and lows. Or periodically drain some of the water and refill with cool source water.

What is the water temp suggested to provide adequate cooling? Is my proposed method more or less a "standard" way of utilizing a closed loop system to be water conservative? Thanks!

[still_stirrin]

How much heat you putting into the boiler?

Power x time = energy. That energy must be collected in the product condenser and moved somewhere....to your reservoir. The size of the reservoir needed depends on how much heat you intend to store there.

Bottomline, it's impossible to say a 37.5 gallon cooler is big enough without knowing how big is your boiler, what you charge it with, and how much heating power you're using to boil with.

Without that info, this is exactly the "how long is a piece of string?" question that Rad is famous for quoting.
ss

[skow69]

Morrey, sorry but you will have to try it to find out. Far too much information missing.

Regarding cooling methods in general:
Given that there is a fixed quantity of heat that must be removed from the distillate for the process to work properly, regardless of how that heat is removed. . .
And assuming that a reservoir of recirculating water will not be capable of absorbing enough heat, and must be replenished with cold water periodically. . .
And assuming that a fresh water supply, run to waste, can be adjusted for good efficiency, i. e. water exits hot. . .

I wonder how much water is really being saved by recirculating in the usual manner. Extraordinary efforts such as using a radiator and fan to cool the water, or using a swimming pool size reservoir would obviously change the calculus. My question here is do we really conserve any water by recirculating a pool with a continuously rising temperature, compared to feeding cold water slowly (efficiently) and run to waste? The number of BTUs doesn't change.

Thoughts, anyone?

EDIT: simulpost

[Morrey]

Agreed. Like asking how fast that car will run? What size engine, what car? Totally understand.

8G pot still to run 5G corn wash fired by propane. I still know that is limited information, and I'll just have to try it to see if it works out.

Probably the most simple approach is a steady trickle/stream of source water ie garden hose which remains a constant temp cooling source. I can try the cooler method and abandon that idea if it is heating up the reservoir too quickly.

[dieselduo]

I use a cooler also. When the water starts to get too warm I put in a frozen bottle of water,when that melts I put in another

[skow69]

Morrey, it might be fun to hook up to the garden hose, catch the output, measure it, and compare that to how much water you use to replenish your reservoir. Prolly best to get a few runs in first, work the bugs out.

Good luck. Let us know what you find out.

[GrassHopper]

Here is a thread going on right now that should help you a lot.
Setting up a recirculating cooling system: http://homedistiller.org/forum/viewtopi ... 87&t=63997

Happy Stilling

[Morrey]

I use a cooler also. When the water starts to get too warm I put in a frozen bottle of water,when that melts I put in another

You made it sound simple! Thanks for the support.

[Morrey]

Morrey, it might be fun to hook up to the garden hose, catch the output, measure it, and compare that to how much water you use to replenish your reservoir. Prolly best to get a few runs in first, work the bugs out.

Good luck. Let us know what you find out.

You're right in that I may be chasing my tail saving a gallon of water and costing me two gallons to do so. I'll try your method and compare...sometimes it takes a few trips around the block to find the best route.

[buflowing]

I run a 15.5 gal boiler with pot still head and recirculating cooling. I use a 5 gal bucket as a reservoir. When it gets too hot, i dump it and refill. I'll go through maybe 8 buckets during a 12 gal strip run, using about 40 gal of water. Temp is constantly cycling from cold to hot for each bucket. Ok for a pot, probably not so for any kind of reflux rig. If you want constant temp, you'll have to incorporate a suitable size chiller (e.g. radiator) of some sort in the plumbing, and then size of reservoir will matter little. Then again, maybe you're using a teapot for a boiler, in which case 37.5 gal should suffice.

[MichiganCornhusker]

I go through about 30 gallons of water for a 10 gallon strip run.
Normally out of the tap, through the Liebig, and down the drain. Not much more than my morning shower.

[rgreen2002]

Morrey, it might be fun to hook up to the garden hose, catch the output, measure it, and compare that to how much water you use to replenish your reservoir. Prolly best to get a few runs in first, work the bugs out.

Good luck. Let us know what you find out.

You're right in that I may be chasing my tail saving a gallon of water and costing me two gallons to do so. I'll try your method and compare...sometimes it takes a few trips around the block to find the best route.

+1

Having a similar discussion on another thread right now. The difference for me from reservoir and multiple changes to direct input from hose was negligible in volume and therefore cost. Maybe if you reused the water... you would notice a difference...YMMV

[wtfdskin]

I go through about 30 gallons of water for a 10 gallon strip run.
Normally out of the tap, through the Liebig, and down the drain. Not much more than my morning shower.

Ive always thought about recording water use with my worm. I use a tiny pond pump with 1/4" tubing and run to waste. Drawn from a cooler. Next run i will see how many times i refill. I truly dont think we use as much water as we think we are.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G891A using Tapatalk

[MrBee]

Can only say this is what works for me.

I have a 7 gallon pot still that i charge with 5 gallons wash, run to a thumper, then through my open top condenser. I have a 12 gallon poly drum with a pond pump at the bottom with a 10 foot garden hose. I just let the hose coil around a hanger on the side of the drum. Just before the inlet to the bottom of the condenser i have an inline pvc gate valve. With the pump on I set the flow just enough to not overwelm the exit hole at top of condenser, if flow is to fast the water will just fill up the condenser and overflow onto the ground. The drum is sitting next to the condenser and the exit hose is only about 12" long so the hot water goes back into the drum by just gravity onto the top of the water. The pump is on the bottom.

I can run two 5 gallon stripping runs back to back and my distillate temp will only rise to around 90° by the end.

I can run one 5.5 gallon spirit run which takes about 8 hours, 6.5 hours of water circulation and the output temp of distillate will be around 85° .

This is in my basement where the temp stays around 65° year round.

Just in case of temps getting higher than I want, I keep a few blocks of ice in the freezer.

I very rarely have to use ice. I have a 6 quart bucket that I freeze water in with a rope to use as a handle once its frozen. I keep 2 of these frozen. IF I use one I just remove 6 quart of water before putting in the ice and refreeze that. The only water that is wasted is what evaporates .

MrBee

[Boda Getta]

If you are running a pot still and running your still hard (stripping run) you are defeating the purpose of a cooling reservoir. The out-flow from your condenser will be warm (if not hot) and the insulated cooler will prevent the water from cooling. I use a similar system, but use a 30 gal Big Brute with a over-flow pipe about 4 inches from the top. If I'm running hard or even making a long spirit run I put a hose pipe with a gate valve in the bottom just cracked open. Works great, never any problem with the in-put water being too warm and very little water is wasted.

Good luck

BG

[The Baker]

Michigan Cornhusker wrote,'I go through about 30 gallons of water for a 10 gallon strip run.
Normally out of the tap, through the Liebig, and down the drain. Not much more than my morning shower.'

If you run it onto the tomato patch you will get full value.
Geoff

[rad14701]

MrBee, your run times sound exceedingly long for a simple pot still... I can do a spirit run of 6 gallons on a stovetop in half that time, under 4 hours, and stripping runs even faster... What are you using for heat...??? Don't go through very much water with my pot still either... Just a trickle is enough to keep my 28" liebig cool all the way up to within a few inches of the top of the liebig where stays fairly warm to the touch yet not hot... My reflux column requires more cooling water because I really need a bit longer concentric reflux condenser...

[MrBee]

MrBee, your run times sound exceedingly long for a simple pot still... I can do a spirit run of 6 gallons on a stovetop in half that time, under 4 hours, and stripping runs even faster... What are you using for heat...??? Don't go through very much water with my pot still either... Just a trickle is enough to keep my 28" liebig cool all the way up to within a few inches of the top of the liebig where stays fairly warm to the touch yet not hot... My reflux column requires more cooling water because I really need a bit longer concentric reflux condenser...

Thanks Rad,
I did a quick check of my notes and the stripping runs seem to take me between 1.5 and 1.45 hours AFTER the first drip.
Spirit Runs take about 6.5 hours after first drip.
My stove top is a single burner counter top made to handle large stock pots. It is 1600Watt
Heat up time - from the time I turn the stove on till the first drip is about 1.5 hours, thats for 5 gallon rum wash with thumper and I usually put about a cup of wash in the thumper.
I just wrapped the boiler with insulation and will be wrapping the thumper so hope that will speed up the heat up time.

Other than changing heat source I'm not sure what I could do to cut the run time.
I do cut the heat back a bit on the spirit run and could just run it all out to see what the diff is.

MrBee

[pounsfos]

if its any help

I have a 200L (52ish gal) cooling tank, that can withstand 2kw of electric power for about 5 hours, what you can do, is get a computer cpu heatsink, and a 5v fan, and wire yourself up something cool. otherwise, run it through copper tube to keep it cooler for longer.
edit: if you wanna be super cool, by a water cooling radiator for a pc, and plumb that in, but I don't know your budget.

I can go 8hours if i use my SSR controller, and turn it down to 1200-1500w, then turn it off and come back the next day and do it all over again.

we don't pay for water here, but I still like to be eco friendly, also my water stops cooling
(likker comes out the top) at about 48c (118f) so it can get hot before you have issues.

If your on the stove top, I would say you will be fine as it is a pot still, but the only way to find out is by doing it, then making changes. have some cold water nearby (your in a kitchen, cant be to hard to find)