Wineos Plain Ol Sugar Wash

[rad14701]

Gravity only at 1.030 from 1.040 a week ago?! Any one have any suggestions? Started this on 3/17 at 1.070. Wonder what the heck is taking so long

There are several reasons why a sugar wash would ferment slow or stall... They are temperature, pH, and nutrients - in that order... Optimal temperature range for most yeasts is a steady 75F - 85F... Most yeast will go dormant as early as the low 70's...

If pH drops below 3.8 - 4 you'll start seeing problems... Adding oyster shells into you wash can help because the shells won't dissolve if pH is in the normal range but will dissolve and adjust pH if the wash goes acidic...

If the wash lacks adequate nutrients the yeast colony might slow, go dormant, or resort to autolysis (cannibalism)...

[PTS_35]

No oyster shells on hand. What about washed egg shells? Thought I read it on this site that egg shells can balance ph.

[crazyk78]

If pH drops below 3.8 - 4 you'll start seeing problems... Adding oyster shells into you wash can help because the shells won't dissolve if pH is in the normal range but will dissolve and adjust pH if the wash goes acidic...

Great tip.

Off topic: Also can be used in aquariums the same way just need to watch water hardness.

[PTS_35]

Wanted to update and see what you all thought. The first 5 gal of this I did I calculated the amount given recipe calls for 6gal and I was doing only 5. I posted it was awful slow and so I went back and added the amounts of DAP and dady that were missing due to the calculations. Here that wash is started on 3/17 and today it's still not finished. Still bubbling slowly and reading was 1.004. On 4/9 I started another only this time I did the full amounts as in original recipe, 8lb sugar, tsp DAP and 1/4cup dady. Topped it off for 5 gal and OG was 1.064. Today it's 1.019. Much faster than the first yet not as fast as I thought they'd be. Figured two weeks and this wash would be finished. Idk if I'm doing something wrong or its the dady and time of year with temps. The room temp with heater on is like 75. Guess I'll just run the first one once it's down to 1.000 and wait on the second. All I can do. Gonna have to get a ph test kit. Start testing that.
..

[PTS_35]

Wanted to post update. I added some egg shells to the first batch of this. They didn't dissolve. Sank and then came to top after 2 or 3 days. As of yesterday 4/26 the gravity finally hit 1.000. Wow. That wash was started on 3/17. Gonna rack to still this weekend and run it. Will check the 2nd one then and see what the gravity is. That one seems to be working faster.

[PTS_35]

2nd batch seems finished at 1.004. Tested twice within 5 days and readings the same. Has anyone tried EC 1118 with this?? Have some of that, was thinking of using it

[PTS_35]

I'm trying the first sip of this sugar wash. Diluted to about 80-83% give or take. I have a pot style still. This tastes sweet on the front then I get a hot bite. Nothing bad. It's weird bc the other neutral I've done, the all bran, had the same smell but it did taste different. And when I started this one I thought one would taste better than the other but now I'm not so sure. I think that they both have theither taste and that's that. They both have their flavor.

[Kegg_jam]

80% or 80 proof?

[PTS_35]

Haha, sorry. 80 proof. 40%. Brings up this qiestion. I don't have a reflux but plan to in future. With that, do you still do stripping runs or does the reflux get rid of that? I thought the idea of a reflux was that it cleaned the distillate up and ran it off at a higher proof? So instead of me doing three stripping and 1 spirit wouldn't I be just doing three "runs" and that's it? I'm just talking about neutral not anything else

[rad14701]

Haha, sorry. 80 proof. 40%. Brings up this qiestion. I don't have a reflux but plan to in future. With that, do you still do stripping runs or does the reflux get rid of that? I thought the idea of a reflux was that it cleaned the distillate up and ran it off at a higher proof? So instead of me doing three stripping and 1 spirit wouldn't I be just doing three "runs" and that's it? I'm just talking about neutral not anything else

That question shows that you haven't been doing a whole lot of reading here because there is almost constantly a topic going about doing stripping runs followed by a spirit run... Seriously, the discussion is damned near constant... Now would be a good time to do that particular bit of research, and perhaps some more while you're at it... Call me an ass for pointing it out but I know because I read... A lot... And I don't even have any unanswered questions... But I answer a lot of questions like this one with the same answers, over and over and over and over...

[PTS_35]

Not to respond and keep putting up more babble on a 32 page thread RAD, but you've been on this site since 07. Which more than likely means you've been messing around with distilling a bit longer than that. I've been doing this really for about a year or two. With that said, I just threw a question out there in response to kegg jam asking about 80%. Why don't you jump his ass since you're patrolling the forums. He shouldn't have asked that question seeing how I said "pot still", which we know wouldn't produce a product so high in % that you'd "dilute" down to that specific percent. At least not my still. Strips put out mid to high 60s and spirits put out mid to high 80s. I haven't even begun to look into the reflux. I got more shit going on, that I can't find the time to even run my dinky little still let alone set time aside to look up info on building a column. I wasn't creating a new thread asking the question I just threw it out there in conversation. Isn't this an open forum? Hell, I've seen guys just talking bs back and forth on some pages.

[rad14701]

Not to respond and keep putting up more babble on a 32 page thread RAD, but you've been on this site since 07. Which more than likely means you've been messing around with distilling a bit longer than that. I've been doing this really for about a year or two. With that said, I just threw a question out there in response to kegg jam asking about 80%. Why don't you jump his ass since you're patrolling the forums. He shouldn't have asked that question seeing how I said "pot still", which we know wouldn't produce a product so high in % that you'd "dilute" down to that specific percent. At least not my still. Strips put out mid to high 60s and spirits put out mid to high 80s. I haven't even begun to look into the reflux. I got more shit going on, that I can't find the time to even run my dinky little still let alone set time aside to look up info on building a column. I wasn't creating a new thread asking the question I just threw it out there in conversation. Isn't this an open forum? Hell, I've seen guys just talking bs back and forth on some pages.

True, there is a lot more off-topic discussion going on both in the Off Topic forum and in supposedly constructive informative forums... But . . . . You've been here long enough to know about our discussions regarding stripping and spirit runs... Most with reflux columns do multiple stripping runs followed by a faster spirit run of the resulting low wines than would be possible with a low %ABV wash... See, I had to answer that same question yet again... Trust me, it does get tiring... The answers are here for those willing to seek them... I know because I've either posted or read them... No offense intended...

[Kegg_jam]

Sorry. I was just skimming through and 'trying a sip at 80%' sort of jumped out at me.

Just wanted to make sure nobody is melting their face off drinking 160 proof booze.

[NattyBoh]

I've had my second slow ferment in a row and scratching my head why. Did one a few weeks ago, followed recipe exactly scaled x2. Got stuck and never cleared after 3+ weeks. Made a new batch last Wednesday, scaled x2 and added some boiled yeast as a nutrient (just in case). It's been 9 days, started at 1.05 and now I'm at 1.02. Ferment started fast but hasn't the moved in a few days. And suggestions? I have run this successfully in the past so I'm not sure what's different.

[BoisBlancBoy]

I've had my second slow ferment in a row and scratching my head why. Did one a few weeks ago, followed recipe exactly scaled x2. Got stuck and never cleared after 3+ weeks. Made a new batch last Wednesday, scaled x2 and added some boiled yeast as a nutrient (just in case). It's been 9 days, started at 1.05 and now I'm at 1.02. Ferment started fast but hasn't the moved in a few days. And suggestions? I have run this successfully in the past so I'm not sure what's different.

Can you check your ph? Especially with sugar washes the ph goes down hard during fermentation. If it has dropped enough it will stall it.

[NattyBoh]

You called it. Ph was 4. I just added 2 handfuls of crushed oyster shells. Hopefully should bring it back. Thanks.

[BoisBlancBoy]

You called it. Ph was 4. I just added 2 handfuls of crushed oyster shells. Hopefully should bring it back. Thanks.

Good luck, let us know if it perks back up.

[NattyBoh]

Late getting back...it did perk back up and I was able to run it a few days later. Just checked my current batch and it too is now at 4. I'll add a few handfuls of oyster shells. Guess going forward I'll just include this step to keep the ph happy.

[Stringduster]

Great recipe Wineo!

I did a stripping run on 12 gallons and threw in about a gallon of feints from a previous run. Did a refluxed spirit run(packed column with copper mesh and ceramic rings) and proof held at 180 for almost the whole duration of the run. Discarded 600 ml of fores.13 jars total. Proof was steady until the middle of jar 12. Jar 13 was about 60 proof. Jars 1-2 taste hot as hell (heads). Jars 3-11 all taste pretty much the same. Think I was possibly stuck in heads faze? That's why proof never dropped? It tastes great, but don't want to feel like shit the day after I drink it.

I would appreciate anyone's feedback. Thanks!

[sgrams]

I recently ran across this page while searching for a all sugar recipe and I'm glad to see it may still be active. I am allowing the first fermentation to clear while the second fermentation is going along nicely which was started from the settled yeast of the first fermentation. Both fermentations consist of the exact amounts of ingredients listed, I used distillers yeast and city water supply with pH of 7. I will come back to let anyone reading this thread know my results.

[TDick]

Thanks Wineo!
First thing, I am a Newb! So take everything I post with a BIG grain of salt.
Now it's not like I bastardized your recipe. I had an idea for a sacrificial run by a newb on a new still.
But I did use your recipe to "enhance" mine.
I started with 3 gallons of Hawaiian Punch. (Had 5, kids disappeared with 2).
Added a 4 lb bag of sugar, and when looking on Youtube for the best way to make invert sugar, I found this video to make Golden Syrup.
https://youtu.be/ksIHlV9T17U" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" rel="nofollow
I thought it looked like taking invert to the next step.
So I just turned a 4 lb bag of sugar into Golden Syrup.
2 Qts. Sugar, 1 Qt. Water

Added a picture to show you the final product before HP
(As you can see, for 4# I used a whole lemon)
I had 2 gallons of HP in a bucket, luke warm.
Brought 2 qts of HP to a boil and blended it with the warm syrup.
(by the way, the aroma of the hot HP smelled like Hot Tea with Lemon with a Tequila back. ??)
Stirred it in to the bucket with the warm HP.
Warmed 2 cups and added 1/4 cup Baker's Yeast stirred and let it sit for about 5 minutes before stirring into the bucket.
Added the rest of the room temp HP to the bucket and stirred with a whisk.
Then put the top on - but did not seal - the bucket before putting it in a warm room.
I'll keep you posted, but any advice or admonitions?
BB

[Still Life]

Don't know if wineo has been on the forum for awhile, but maybe he'll answer.
I'm getting a haunting suspicion that you want to eventually drink this.
But if it's a sacrificial run, you know it all has to go down the drain. No tasting or drinking!
Please tell me I'm wrong and this is all for practice. I'm only concerned for your health.

[butterpants]

Not sure if I missed it in the 96 pages but has anyone gone over the specific purpose of all the ingredients initially listed?

I've tried this recipie and found the pH crashed hard and stuck even at a 1.060 starting gravity... so I altered it a bit.

But back to my inital query.... the specific reasons why certain compounds are added to the wash...

Gypsum (Calcium Sulfate) - pH buffering and Ca source for yeast... aids in flocculation

Epsom Salts (Magnesium Sulfate) - source of Mg, needed for yeast health in very low amounts

DAP (Diammonium Phosphate) - source of N for yeast, nutrient

Citric Acid - I'm not sure yet why this is in there. Anyone?

[zeetwoeight]

So I'm definitely going to try this wash, my very first was with turbo products and it has a bit off an off taste . Gonna let it settle clear for another week but maybe I'm stuck with this flavor. So my question is can this plain ole sugar wash once cleared be consumed as is without distilling? How neutral is it in taste? could essences be added after on a bottle by bottle basis. At the moment I'm not up for moving to distilling and would be content with a 15 to 18 percent wash. Cheers

[Still Life]

So I'm definitely going to try this wash, my very first was with turbo products and it has a bit off an off taste . Gonna let it settle clear for another week but maybe I'm stuck with this flavor. So my question is can this plain ole sugar wash once cleared be consumed as is without distilling? How neutral is it in taste? could essences be added after on a bottle by bottle basis. At the moment I'm not up for moving to distilling and would be content with a 15 to 18 percent wash. Cheers

This would be closer to 8% as a non-turbo wash.
I'm not sure this would be that tasty without distilling, and adding flavoring may just make it worse.
Not even sure if it's SAFE to drink undistilled.
You should really consider getting a still for greater success and enjoyment.

[zeetwoeight]

thx still life. 8% may kill this idea then. not going for a still at the moment. what safety concerns would there be? I've brewed lots of beer and wine and I figured this wasn't much different... sugar water yeast and fermentation time. but getting a neutral taste would be the biggest goal. all a learning curve at the moment so any and all info appreciated. Cheers.

[Still Life]

thx still life. 8% may kill this idea then. not going for a still at the moment. what safety concerns would there be? I've brewed lots of beer and wine and I figured this wasn't much different... sugar water yeast and fermentation time. but getting a neutral taste would be the biggest goal. all a learning curve at the moment so any and all info appreciated. Cheers.

I could be wrong, but I'm wary of what effects drinking an Epsom salt and DAP cocktail would have.
For one, drinking Epsom salts will give you the shits....

[zeetwoeight]

lol... good point Still Life.

[Pikey]

Friend of mine used to make (And drink) - "Turbo Cider" apple juice, sugar and Turbo yeast to boost alcohol content.

He seemed to like it

[Jafa5]

Just put down my first sugar wash. 6kg of dextrose and 25 litres of water with a vodka yeast pack. I didn't put anything else in though, guessing the yeast pack has everything the yeast needs for a healthy ferment. I should probably go check the SG... Two 25 litre batches and two 25 litre batches of honey rum. Happy days

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