WillieP's World

[WillieP]

Hey Y'all,
I wanted a spot to document my journey, and to be able to look back and see what has worked well and what has not for me. As I mentioned in the introduce yourself post, my journey began back in 2018 but was put on hold. SWMBO was working at the local school and was not comfortable with the idea of me making likker. She has since then retired and has given her approval.
When I was originally researching the topic, my interests were to make the best possible drop that I was able to produce. That still holds true today. I would rather produce one small bottle of exceptional distillate than a boat load of just drinkable stuff. Of course, I understand that does not happen without putting in the work to get there.
I have been making homemade wines for close to 20 years, I homebrewed for 6-8 years before they made me go "gluten free", and I have dabbled in mead making as well. I hope to not have any issues with the fermentation side of things.
Now, turning a wort, or beer, or wash, or must, or wine, or a mead, or whatever you want to call it; into something of higher proof is where I have NO experience at all.
You read over and over again that this is a hobby that requires patience. I started researching this hobby 8 years ago. I read and researched of many months before I set it aside, and now I am doing all the reading and refreshing that I feel is needed before I ever do a run.
I will be using one of my 8-gal heavy bottom brew kettles (from homebrewing) as my boiler, along with a SS salad bowel to a 2" copper column. Running on propane. My original idea was to just make a traditional pot still setup. The more I dug into the different types of stills, the more I liked the idea of a CCVM. As I understand it, it can be run as a pot still (no packing and the RC just kept above the take-off) or as a reflux (I will use copper mesh).
My real interest is in flavored stuff, "bourbon" and rum, so the vast majority of the time I would just run as a pot still.
The take-off will go to a 36" Liebig style PC, 1/2-inch spiral wrapped with a 14-gauge copper wire and a 1" outer jacket. Also made a copper sheet spiraled insert to slide into the 1/2-inch vapor path which may be totally unnecessary. From what I have read, I should have plenty of knock down power.
All of those pieces have been built years ago and never been put in use. I will have to break them out to be able to get the exact length of the column and pictures to post.
I understand that I will need to do the proper cleaning procedures, including a sac run. I will just do a sugar wash for that.
When it comes time to actually make a real run, I will give BB's Rum a go. Looking down the road, I am interested in the idea of an AG "bourbon type" likker made with specialty grains, although I haven't done enough research to be specific about what grain bill to use.
Well, that seems like enough of a first post for the journal. If any of you more experienced members would care to offer your constructive criticisms or words of wisdom, you are most welcome to do so.
Cheers All, and happy stillin!
WillieP

[VLAGAVULVIN]

Have a good one here

[subbrew]

Welcome. If you made/make your column modular you can just remove the reflux column when you want a post still. A couple of tri-clamp ferrules and a clamp will do it. Since you did a salad bowel to a copper column I assume you have the skill to weld or solder the ferrules to a copper pipe. you will not have to deal with the RC at all then. And it will be a shorter system, easier to work with and handle for your pot work.

[The Booze Pipe]

It sounds like you're more interested in alternative or "alt" whiskeys to bourbon? Look into Shineoncrazydiamond's recipes like the Honey Bear Bourbon. But I really encourage you to get the book "Alt Whiskeys" by Derek Bell. I've been flipping through it, and there's some mind expanding stuff in it

[WillieP]

Welcome. If you made/make your column modular you can just remove the reflux column when you want a post still. A couple of tri-clamp ferrules and a clamp will do it. Since you did a salad bowel to a copper column I assume you have the skill to weld or solder the ferrules to a copper pipe. you will not have to deal with the RC at all then. And it will be a shorter system, easier to work with and handle for your pot work.

Welcome subbrew,
I have been doing a lot of reading on the "how to's" of running a CCVM. I like the idea of being able to use it in various ways. I was under the misconception that if I raised the RC all the way above the take-off that I would be using it as a pot still. NOT THE CASE. I have a 2-to-2-to-2-inch T, so with the RC coil raised above the take-off I would still have 50% reflux. I have left the top of the column pipe "bald", so now my thought is that I can pull the RC and simply use a 2-inch copper cap and either flour paste of Teflon tape to seal the cap. I don't have any experience with any of this, so this is all just theory for me at this point. I would still have a column full of copper mesh, would that still have some reflux even without the RC? Or after the column temperature stabilizes would this act as just a pot still?
As far as the salad bowel connection, I used a female flange bolted to the salad bowel and a 2-inch male threaded fitting to thread into it.
As always, all input welcome.
Cheers,
WillieP

[WillieP]

It sounds like you're more interested in alternative or "alt" whiskeys to bourbon? Look into Shineoncrazydiamond's recipes like the Honey Bear Bourbon. But I really encourage you to get the book "Alt Whiskeys" by Derek Bell. I've been flipping through it, and there's some mind expanding stuff in it

Booze Pipe,
Welcome.
Funny you would mention HBB, I have just spent the last few days reading though all 41 pages of that thread and have honey malt in my shopping cart.
I posted in that thread that I have a large variety of specialty malts on hand, (just not honey malt) and I asked for input on their uses in that type of recipe. It sounds like that book would be very interesting to me. Thank you for the suggestion.
Cheers,
WillieP

[MooseMan]

Hey Willie.

I have a modular ccvm and run it as a pot still by simply removing the column, flipping over the tee and capping the top, it's that simple.

If you need pictures let me know.

Moose

[WillieP]

Hey Willie.

I have a modular ccvm and run it as a pot still by simply removing the column, flipping over the tee and capping the top, it's that simple.

If you need pictures let me know.

Moose

Hey MooseMan,
Welcome!
When you say 'Modular', I am guessing that you are talking TC fittings?
My column is just standard plumbing fittings soldered together. That's going to make things a little bit more difficult for me to swap things.
What are your thoughts on me just pulling the RC and capping the top of the column?
Will that work? Or do I need to figure out how to just have an empty column going straight to the PC?
Thanks for your input. (keep in mind that I have never ran any kind of still yet)
All works of wisdom welcome!
Cheers,
WillieP

[WillieP]

As I mentioned above, I have read the entire HBB thread, and it sounds like it's something right up my alley. It's a T & T for a reason, right?
I did say that I wanted to start off with BB's rum recipe, but I have changed my mind and will be wanting the HBB to be my first real run. I want to run the original as a base reference, then run a batch with the added oats, then be able to play with what specialty grains are added. (holding the specialty grain to 5% of the grain bill)
With my setup, these will be approximately 6-gallon batches, just made in brewing buckets.
Does anyone have a recommendation on what to make as the sac run? Yes, I know I can google search it.
My thought is just enough sugar to get to about 1.060, some boiled yeast as nutrient, maybe through in some tomato paste. After all, I don't care what it tastes like. I am just throwing it away.
As always, thanks for your input.
Cheers,
WillieP

[MooseMan]

Could you post some pictures of your still for us?
The top of the boiler, the connection between still head and the top, that sort of thing.

Yeah a std sugar wash is fine for a sac run, throw something in there to stop it going too acidic, anything calcium based, shells or whatever, or even a couple hands full of any kind of grain, just to buffer the pH.

[WillieP]

Well, I guess posting pictures is not a strong suit of mine. I will need to practice up on this.

[WillieP]

[WillieP]

[WillieP]

Could you post some pictures of your still for us?
The top of the boiler, the connection between still head and the top, that sort of thing.

Well, that was a trip on the struggle bus!!
Sorry for my lack of ability to add photos to a post. I'll need to work on that.

[WillieP]

I went down to the basement and retrieved my still head that had been drawing dust for a really long time.
My memory is not as good as it used to be.
What I thought was a 2x2x2 takeoff in NOT, it's a 2x1.5x2. So, my earlier comment about the reflux ratio was incorrect. My Bad. It's been years since I built that.
Starting at the salad bowl: 2 copper plates sandwiching sheet cork top and bottom, bolted on with SS hardware. Next there is a male threaded adaptor soldered in place to the top copper plate.
The column is 30 inches long, and is not soldered in place, just friction fitted.
At the other end of the column there is the previous mentioned 2x1.5x2 inch T soldered in place.
Out of the top of the T there is a short male nipple soldered in.
Above the nipple is a sweat coupling to a 6-inch piece of pipe, neither of which are soldered. The idea here is to be able to remove the coupling and 6-inch nipple and replace them with a copper cap when not using the RC.
Following the vaper path to the takeoff, the output of the T is 1.5 inch, that is then reduced to 1 inch, which goes to a 3-piece coupling, (I know this as a 'union') for the attachment of the PC.
The other side of the union is then reduced from 1 to 3/4 inch. The PC is 36 inches long with 1 inch water jacket over 3/4-inch vapor path. The 3/4 is spiral wrapped with 14-gauge solid wire to help disturb the water flow. There is also a length of sheet copper that is cut to be inserted into the vapor path. It is twisted to try and disturb the vapor flow. (I am guessing that this is completely unnecessary.)
I think that pretty much covers it. If you have and questions of input, feel free.
Cheers,
WillieP

[MooseMan]

I went down to the basement and retrieved my still head that had been drawing dust for a really long time.
My memory is not as good as it used to be.
What I thought was a 2x2x2 takeoff in NOT, it's a 2x1.5x2. So, my earlier comment about the reflux ratio was incorrect. My Bad. It's been years since I built that.
Starting at the salad bowl: 2 copper plates sandwiching sheet cork top and bottom, bolted on with SS hardware. Next there is a male threaded adaptor soldered in place to the top copper plate.
The column is 30 inches long, and is not soldered in place, just friction fitted.
At the other end of the column there is the previous mentioned 2x1.5x2 inch T soldered in place.
Out of the top of the T there is a short male nipple soldered in.
Above the nipple is a sweat coupling to a 6-inch piece of pipe, neither of which are soldered. The idea here is to be able to remove the coupling and 6-inch nipple and replace them with a copper cap when not using the RC.
Following the vaper path to the takeoff, the output of the T is 1.5 inch, that is then reduced to 1 inch, which goes to a 3-piece coupling, (I know this as a 'union') for the attachment of the PC.
The other side of the union is then reduced from 1 to 3/4 inch. The PC is 36 inches long with 1 inch water jacket over 3/4-inch vapor path. The 3/4 is spiral wrapped with 14-gauge solid wire to help disturb the water flow. There is also a length of sheet copper that is cut to be inserted into the vapor path. It is twisted to try and disturb the vapor flow. (I am guessing that this is completely unnecessary.)
I think that pretty much covers it. If you have and questions of input, feel free.
Cheers,
WillieP

Those pictures are totally fine Willie, just get the hang of rotating them before attaching and you'll be good.

Ok, a couple of options.
As you have the column just friction fitted (I have the same on my gin still and I just put a wrap of PTFE tape around it before fitting) into the copper fitting on the bowl, you could make a dedicated pot still head super easy for stripping and running Whisky/Rum etc.
All you need is a short section of 2" for the riser, a pair of 90° elbows so you've got angle adjustment, a reducer and another fitting the same as you already have, to attach your PC.

Second, far less ideal option is to cap the top as you say, then run with the column unpacked and/or insulated so it doesn't act as a reflux column.

[WillieP]

Those pictures are totally fine Willie, just get the hang of rotating them before attaching and you'll be good.

Ok, a couple of options.
As you have the column just friction fitted (I have the same on my gin still and I just put a wrap of PTFE tape around it before fitting) into the copper fitting on the bowl, you could make a dedicated pot still head super easy for stripping and running Whisky/Rum etc.
All you need is a short section of 2" for the riser, a pair of 90° elbows so you've got angle adjustment, a reducer and another fitting the same as you already have, to attach your PC.

Second, far less ideal option is to cap the top as you say, then run with the column unpacked and/or insulated so it doesn't act as a reflux column.

Thanks MM!
I totally agree with everything you have said.
And you are right, it wouldn't take much to put together a bit of copper for a dedicated pot still head. Good suggestion, and probably the smart choice.
I just don't have any experience at what type of still gives you what type of product.
There are so many people running so many different still heads in so many ways to get so many different products from the same wash/mash. It becomes a bit overwhelming to know what direction to jump in.
I know that this is just my lack of experience and my ignorance talking. I will start with the tried and true, strip, strip, strip, spirit on a pot still and see what I get and then go from there.
I really like the idea of running a CCVM as a reflux, but I feel like that should be a little farther down the path for me.
I appreciate you input!
Cheers,
WillieP

[MooseMan]

I just don't have any experience at what type of still gives you what type of product.
There are so many people running so many different still heads in so many ways to get so many different products from the same wash/mash. It becomes a bit overwhelming to know what direction to jump in.

WillieP


If you build a simple pot still head as I described Willie, you can make fine Rum, bourbon, whisky, brandy with that for many years. There will be guys on this forum with literally decades of experience, who are still running a simple pot still.

The CCVM is for making high proof neutral, that's all it does.

[WillieP]

WillieP
If you build a simple pot still head as I described Willie, you can make fine Rum, bourbon, whisky, brandy with that for many years. There will be guys on this forum with literally decades of experience, who are still running a simple pot still.

The CCVM is for making high proof neutral, that's all it does.

Thanks MooseMan for giving me your recommendations.

Is there any advantage or disadvantage to having a given height to the vertical column of the pot still? I can't come up with one in my head. As long as it fits on my salad bowl and couples up to the PC it's just basically a pathway for vapor to get from the brew kettle to the PC. (I'll use the search function, but while I had ya, I thought I would ask your opinion.)
I appreciate you taking the time to nudge a noobie in the right direction!
Cheers,
WillieP

[Yummyrum]

Hey Willie

The Riser ( it’s called a Column when it’s packed of a reflux still) can be any length that makes it convenient to collect under . It can be short if you don’t mind changing jars on the floor , or, you can make it taller so that it means the end of your condenser is closer to bench height .

Taller riser may allow a bit of passive reflux if it’s really cold in your still house and you are running really slowly . (IE , the extra mass of the riser can give up proportionally more heat to the surroundings .)
Some claim this little bit of extra reflux ,( it acts as a form of deflegmator, ) can result in a little better separation during a spirit run .

If you wrap a towel around the riser , it will insulate it and it’s length will be negligible.

[MooseMan]

Eloquently put by yummy there, I don't think I need say more!

Start a build thread when you are ready to get going Willie, we will wade in and help.

[subbrew]

Sorry I didn't get to reply earlier Willie. But it looks like you have all the answers you need. I will second the dedicated riser idea but the capped and insulated 30 inch column will work as well. Just take a bit longer to get everything warmed up and product to drip.

[WillieP]

Hey Willie

The Riser ( it’s called a Column when it’s packed of a reflux still) can be any length that makes it convenient to collect under . It can be short if you don’t mind changing jars on the floor , or, you can make it taller so that it means the end of your condenser is closer to bench height .

Taller riser may allow a bit of passive reflux if it’s really cold in your still house and you are running really slowly . (IE , the extra mass of the riser can give up proportionally more heat to the surroundings .)
Some claim this little bit of extra reflux ,( it acts as a form of deflegmator, ) can result in a little better separation during a spirit run .

If you wrap a towel around the riser , it will insulate it and it’s length will be negligible.

Yummyrum,
Welcome, and thank you for your input!
Last night I was just google searching the subject and made the discovery that I had been mis-using the term column, instead of using the proper term, riser. My Bad. Thanks for pointing it out to me.
On the existing CCVM that I attached photos of, there is a 1-inch union that make the connection from still head to PC. This was done intentionally for a couple of reasons. First, to be able to change the slope angle of the PC to be able to adjust the height of the product collection point. And secondly, to be able to make it somewhat modular. The thought being if I wanted to add a thumper at some point in the future, I would be able to use the same connection.
I will make the takeoff of the pot still with the same connection, for the same reasons.

From what I read on the topic of riser height; it seems to be more of a personal choice that a 'it must be this' type of thing.
Seems like anything that physical works for your set up will produce nearly identical product.

Cheers,
WillieP

[WillieP]

Eloquently put by yummy there, I don't think I need say more!

Start a build thread when you are ready to get going Willie, we will wade in and help.

Copy that, Mooseman!
I thank you for your time and effort!
WillieP

[WillieP]

Sorry I didn't get to reply earlier Willie. But it looks like you have all the answers you need. I will second the dedicated riser idea but the capped and insulated 30 inch column will work as well. Just take a bit longer to get everything warmed up and product to drip.

All good subbrew!
I think I have a better grasp on what direction to turn to.
Thanks for your help!
WillieP

[WillieP]

Hey Gang,
I just posted a question over in the pot distillation/thumper design page.
I thought it might get more coverage over there than in my journal.
If this is not the proper protocol, please let me know. Thanks.

viewtopic.php?t=94163

Cheers,
WillieP

[Saltbush Bill]

An educated guess tells me that 99% the people who will give you a worthwhile answer, read just about every new post to the forum.
They would have found it without the link I think, not that it matters that you did.