MY SUPER SIMPLE CONTROLLER

[Scribbler]

It occurs to me:

Since the pot is basically just generating resistance between 0 and 500k ohm, you could theoretically message the resistance of the pot when you have it dialled in for your perfect strip speed, and again for your ideal spirit run speed...

Then, instead of twiddling a variable knob, you could wire up a rotary switch and individual resistors (corresponding to your measurements) and feed THAT into the ssr - just click click click and it's all set to go...

Thoughts?

[RedwoodHillBilly]

Or you could just use a knob that has numbers on it. But, you want to be sure that the numbers go to 11 for when you need that little extra bit of power.

"But it goes to eleven" - Nigel Tufnel

[Scribbler]

I would think that you could just increase the power of the thing itself, and just make ten THAT much higher...

[Scribbler]

But yeah you are right. My idea is a stupid amount of extra work for something that can be done with a sharpie and a label-maker!!!

[cranky]

I find that dialing it in without any complications is pretty easy for the way I run and don't really need anything all that precise and repeatable. Even without the gauge it was pretty easy to dial it in but with it I can get repeatable numbers pretty easy but I find different things require different settings. A lot of people get pretty complicated in their controllers but I personally don't feel the need to and recommend keeping it simple at least until you know how it works.
Note: Posting with others

But yeah you are right. My idea is a stupid amount of extra work for something that can be done with a sharpie and a label-maker!!!

I don't think it's a stupid idea at all, It is an idea that lends itself to automation pretty easily but I think simple is a good way to start then start playing around and make it as complicated as you like. And I like the highest setting to be "Chernobyl" which is way higher than 11

[RedwoodHillBilly]

And I like the highest setting to be "Chernobyl" which is way higher than 11

[FreeMountainHermit]

I have no idea, to me it is all pure freaking magic but it works which is whats important to me.

Exactly. I copied the images of proven wiring diagrams here @ HD and saved them to a folder.

No more nightmares and agonizing "WTFs"



K.I.S.S.

[cranky]

And I like the highest setting to be "Chernobyl" which is way higher than 11

I need to give credit where it is due on that but I can't remember who it was that came up with the Chernobyl setting

[heartcut]

Worked with a couple Chernobyl veterans in the '80's, they would have liked that option. Turn it up!

[BasementBrewer]

Hey guys, long time lurker, newbie poster here. First I want to thank
cranky for breaking down how to make this controller. Huge help. I also
want to thank the rest of you guys for making this such an awesome
community and donating your experiences and knowledge. ANYWAYS, I finally
attempted to make a controller like Crankys. Had some bumps and bruises
along the way, even broke some tools to the point where i had to break out
the torch! (Thats why the fan hole/box is all burnt. Once its up and
running it will get broken down and a nice new paint job will be given.)
Anyways I got everything wired up and plugged the thing in. What I found
was my amp meter only reading 120 volts and 0 amps. Im sure I have it wired
up wrong so please chime in! Even with he amp meter reading 120 and 0, when
i would twist my potentiometer, it would fluctuate by about 1-2 volts.
Hoping you guys can give me some insight into where I went wrong!

I think the best way to do this is to explain where each wire is going
since it can be hard to tell from the picture. -From the outlet, Red (Hot)-
goes into 2 pole switch, from switch to SSR, from SSR through voltage meter
transformer and on to the element. -From the outlet, Black (Hot)- into
switch, from switch through transformer and on to the element. -From the
outlet, White (Ground)- I have two separate grounds in the box, one for the
white ground wires, and one for the SSR and voltage meter. (I have no clue
if this works, but trying to put all 4 wires on one ground was tough.) I have the 2 wires going from the SSR to the pot.
From the meter I have one hot wire tied into the input side of the SSR
(after the switch) and one tied into ground. The fan came with a plug in
cord so I run that directly to the wall, separate from the controller.
Please if you can see where I went wrong let me know!

Thanks,
BasementBrewer

[cranky]

I think the best way to do this is to explain where each wire is going
since it can be hard to tell from the picture. -From the outlet, Red (Hot)-
goes into 2 pole switch, from switch to SSR, from SSR through voltage meter
transformer and on to the element. -From the outlet, Black (Hot)- into
switch, from switch through transformer and on to the element. -From the
outlet, White (Ground)- I have two separate grounds in the box, one for the
white ground wires, and one for the SSR and voltage meter. (I have no clue
if this works, but trying to put all 4 wires on one ground was tough.) I have the 2 wires going from the SSR to the pot.
From the meter I have one hot wire tied into the input side of the SSR
(after the switch) and one tied into ground. The fan came with a plug in
cord so I run that directly to the wall, separate from the controller.
Please if you can see where I went wrong let me know!

Thanks,
BasementBrewer

First I'm not crazy about having to look at a PDF to see the picture but From what I see you have both wires running through the little donut thing (transformer). I believe you are only supposed to have one wire running through that. The other problem is you only have one hot wire to the meter so it is only reading one leg which will show 120V. Both hot wires need to go to the meter to read 220-240V.

[BasementBrewer]

Cranky, sorry about the pdf, its the only thing i could get the file size small enough to post! I rewired the voltage meter like you said and voila! Works great! Just want to thank you again for all your help!

[cranky]

Cranky, sorry about the pdf, its the only thing i could get the file size small enough to post! I rewired the voltage meter like you said and voila! Works great! Just want to thank you again for all your help!

Your welcome, glad I could help

[BasementBrewer]

Cranky, I had my controller working great and ran some vinegar through for a cleaning run. That baby heats up quick! Once the vinegar was done I went ahead and put about 12 gallons of mash in and went to turn on the controller and now I have 240V, but no amperage at all. Thought maybe the pot went bad so i threw another on it and nothing. Checked voltage at the element and its 240.. Could the SSR be bad? It's damn near brand new but I don't know what else could be causing this..

Thanks,
BB

[BasementBrewer]

Update: I tried bypassing the SSR and just connecting the two hot wires straight through.. Still no amps? Any suggestions?

[sw_reijnders]

Update: I tried bypassing the SSR and just connecting the two hot wires straight through.. Still no amps? Any suggestions?

measure Ohms directly on the element.
what do you get?

[BasementBrewer]

Unfortunately I only have a cheap voltage tester. The only way I measure amps is from the voltage/amp meter mounted on the box. I can go buy one, what would the results tell me?

[BasementBrewer]

Update: I tried bypassing the SSR and just connecting the two hot wires straight through.. Still no amps? Any suggestions?

measure Ohms directly on the element.
what do you get?

Bought tester, measured ohms with wires attached and then with no wires attached to element and couldn't get a reading at all. What does this tell me?

Thanks,
BB

[cranky]

Update: I tried bypassing the SSR and just connecting the two hot wires straight through.. Still no amps? Any suggestions?

measure Ohms directly on the element.
what do you get?

Bought tester, measured ohms with wires attached and then with no wires attached to element and couldn't get a reading at all. What does this tell me?

Thanks,
BB

Sounds like a blown element to me. Can you look inside and see if it looks blown out. Did you by some chance run it dry?

[BasementBrewer]

I'd be willing to bet that's what happened. Ran that vinegar and it boiled off way faster than I had anticipated. Must not have shut it down in time.. Oh well I'll throw another one in it I guess and report back! Thanks guys.

[cranky]

I'd be willing to bet that's what happened. Ran that vinegar and it boiled off way faster than I had anticipated. Must not have shut it down in time.. Oh well I'll throw another one in it I guess and report back! Thanks guys.

I think that happens to just about everybody at one time or another when they switch to electric but they really are awesome to use.

[frodo]

The attachment 2015-05-22 19.14.02.jpg is no longer available

I got it together and heated up some water. Very happy with the way everything. Very happy with the controller. Thanks Cranky

Am i looking at likker liker's attachment wrong?

the amp/volt meter, the power to it, it feeds from BOTH 220 hot leads doesnt it?

his looks like it is fed from 1 hot lead and the other is grounded.

am I correct in what i am seeing ? and wrong in my assumption of how it hooks up?

[rad14701]

frodo, I'm sure I'm not the only member who wants to know how you came up with that filename, bathroom_layout_dims_door.jpg, for the schematic above...

[still_stirrin]

Am i looking at likker liker's attachment wrong?..the amp/volt meter, the power to it, it feeds from BOTH 220 hot leads doesnt it?...his looks like it is fed from 1 hot lead and the other is grounded...am I correct in what i am seeing?...and wrong in my assumption of how it hooks up?

Whew...after I got done wiping the coffee off my keyboard (thanks Rad) and blowing my nose, I looked at the referenced schematic more closely. It looks correct, although not too tidy.

The 220V power (+V and -V) come in through the "plug" (the rectangle at the bottom). The +V goes directly to the element with a branch going to the voltmeter to measure "part" of the voltage. The -V goes to the SSR with a branch going to the voltmeter to measure "the rest" of the voltage. Since the voltmeter is a very high resistance device, it only flows a few milliamps (negligible almost).

The SSR then regulates the current by modulating the voltage through the circuit which feeds the element (remember +V and -V are BOTH needed to complete the circuit). That means that the current flowing through the red lead is the same current flowing through the black lead.

Since the current is the same through both leads to/from the element, the current is meassured using the ammeter's torroidal transformer which encircles one of the leads to/from the element. The transformer generates a small current in the ammeter's input circuit (hopefully to avoid burning out the meter) which is then read on the display. Again, this meter current is very small, almost negligible. But like the voltmeter current, it does consume some power.

It looks like that's the way the schematic is drawn, albeit quite messy (hence Rad's comment).

I hope my explanation is understandable to you and the many others who will read this in the future.
ss

[frodo]

frodo, I'm sure I'm not the only member who wants to know how you came up with that filename, bathroom_layout_dims_door.jpg, for the schematic above...

I reuse files that I draw,,,,the original was a dimensional bathroom drawing I had done for someone.
I just edited the page to a blank, then drew in a new picture.



like that, or..

It's what I do.$$$$

When I am not playing with copper and building control box's
I will look again at the picture, thanks for the response
Still-Stirrin and Rad..


I am still confused, sorry to be a pita

[frodo]

ahhhhhh.....he is running 110 not 220....

that is why,, 220 goes to both hot legs, 120 goes to 1 leg and a ground

[UnSub]

..........Would you know:.........
If I can use this SSR? And I'm assuming that if I do use this relay then I would need the 32v to get the full power to the element also?

[frodo]

..........Would you know:.........
If I can use this SSR? And I'm assuming that if I do use this relay then I would need the 32v to get the full power to the element also?

see them squiggly lines ? gotta have them sqiuggle lines. [under the writing SSR VA]

something to do with the pot. controlling it.

I think, not sure, Cranky knows. Boys a friggin genius or a mad scientist.

[still_stirrin]

..........Would you know:.........
If I can use this SSR? And I'm assuming that if I do use this relay then I would need the 32v to get the full power to the element also?

Yes, that particular SSR (solid state relay) requires a control voltage to regulate the SSR output. Most here use one that simply requires resistance (potentiometer).

Yours will work but you'll need a variable voltage source (between 0 & 32 volts, DC I believe). You can get that with a power supply and a variable voltage divider circuit. A little more complicated than the simple pot solution.
ss

[RedwoodHillBilly]

..........Would you know:.........
If I can use this SSR? And I'm assuming that if I do use this relay then I would need the 32v to get the full power to the element also?

Yes, that particular SSR (solid state relay) requires a control voltage to regulate the SSR output. Most here use one that simply requires resistance (potentiometer).

Yours will work but you'll need a variable voltage source (between 0 & 32 volts, DC I believe). You can get that with a power supply and a variable voltage divider circuit. A little more complicated than the simple pot solution.
ss

Sorry guys, that's not quit right. That SSR is the most common type. The control voltage (anywhere between 3V and 32V) will just turn it on. It isn't a phase angle controller i.e. variable output, it is just an on/off switch.