Bleach as Steriliser

[Boozehound]

This question relates more to fermentation than distillation. Can household bleach be used to sterilise these items safely:

1.) Food grade plastic fermentation buckets - typical winemaking stuff.

2.) Glass demijohns.


If so, what ratio of bleach to water should be used and how long should the solution be in the vessel?

The reason I ask is because I hate having to keep ordering special winemaking steriliser because of the P&P costs. Bleach can be got at the supermarket.

If anyone else has a cheap method of sterilising their stuff I'd appreciate hearing about it.

Cheers.

[noobsauce]

I use bleach and seem to have no problems. As to ratio i just pour alittle straight bleach into my bucket and spend about 5 minutes wiping it down all over. Figure if anything can live through straight bleach it isnt killable..lol

[radio11]

Boozehound,i have used bleach in the past,but always kinda tasted it somewere down the line.no matter how much u wipe it out or wash it out. the best stuff i think is just good old sodium metabisulphite,around here i can buy 500gr for 5.00 bucks canadian and that makes 50 gal.that cleans alot of bottles fermenters and they say its good in barrels when they sit empty,just to stop any mold or crap that may try and form.

[rubber duck]

I have used bleach and it's kinda a wast of time. If you use bleach you have to rinse the hell out of it with fresh water and then your not sterile. So what was acompished?

What I do is use oxey clean to clean the fermentor right after its empty. Then when im ready to fill it back up I hit it with a iodine solution. Weak Iodine solution doesn't need to be rinsed and the fermentor should be filled up immediately after the iodine is dumped out don't let it dry.

This is a cheep sanitation method and works well for me I don't get many infections.

[blind drunk]

Yeah bleach needs too much rinsing to make sure it's all rinsed away. A friend worked in some kind of lab and she said bleach needs to be rinsed at least 6-8 times before all the bleach is gone. bd.

[MuleKicker]

I know you are suposed to air out bleach fumes for some time before using the bucket......nasty stuff.

[radio11]

MuleKicker,i think thats what it is,fumes?just hanges out way to long.if ur in the jungle and want to drink some last resort water.bleach will do the trick.

[rad14701]

Over the years, once I start using equipment for distillation, I never do more than rinse with hot water... Never even use soap... Haven't had any infections or been unable to keep things fully cleaned... Maybe I've just been lucky but it's worked for me...

[noobsauce]

After i use bleach i use distilled water to rinse well and i let my stuff sit overnight. I dont notice any smell or have any problems.

[HookLine]

Bleach is overkill, except maybe for the first time you use a new fermenter.

Better off getting some sanitiser/cleaner from the brew store. It is cheap, effective, and rinses off very easily, and is designed specifically for this purpose.

Apart from the initial clean and sterilise of a new fermenter, I only use hot water and dishwashing detergent. Also when I am in a rum cycle, I just give the fermenter a good rinse, and use hot backset (dunder) to dissolve the sugars, etc, inside the fermenter, and sanitise everything. Have not had an infected wash yet (touch wood).

EDIT: I do not use harsh scourers on plastic fermenters, it will scratch the surface and leave places for bugs to hide. I only use soft cellulose based cloths or sponges.

[Barney Fife]

The active ingredient in household bleach is sodium hypochlorite; IE: liquid chlorine. The only difference is that household bleach is 40% weaker than full strength(roughly an 11% solution is used in water treatment plants). Even if you had full strength hypo, and used it full strength, as long as you let it breath a few hours, it is gone from your equipment, and for sure has sanitized everything.

It's all I've ever used; well, bleach, and saved up foreshots. I hate sulphites, as they make me stuffy right away, and these -never- leave your equipment. I only use a weak bleach solution of 1 tbsp to approx. one quart water, and only on new equipment, and anything that's been left out and not rinsed right away, and even that mixture is way overkill. In clean, clear water, only 50 parts per million of hypo is needed to kill all bacteria. If you can easily taste the chlorine(bleach), it's too strong. Contact time is the key; the chlorine needs a set amount of time in contact with the bacteria to kill it, so this is where washing carefully and slowly comes into play; don't just splash it around. The better you are at using it, the weaker you can use it at.

Otherwise, continuous ferments don't need sanitizing, as long as you can get the yeast going again, soon. Your saved up foreshots are also great sanitizers; any alcohol over 20% ABV will sanitize nicely, and works well on siphons, spoons, and all other stuff..

[blanikdog]

Over the years, once I start using equipment for distillation, I never do more than rinse with hot water... Never even use soap... Haven't had any infections or been unable to keep things fully cleaned... Maybe I've just been lucky but it's worked for me...

Same with me. Maybe, we've both been lucky?

blanik

[Boozehound]

I like the idea of using the foreshots to sterilise stuff (finally a use for them), but wouldn't that leach some stuff out of the plastic? I guess demijohns would be safe.

Jury's out on bleach, then. If I do use it I'll wash it well afterwards.

Thanks for the info.

[olddog]

I use the stuff you use for babies bottles, its called Milton, you can get it from most supermarkets or chemist's. If its safe for babies bottles its gotto be safe for me, cheap too.

[ScottishBoy]

While I havent done a whole lot with stills in a while, beer and wine I have always had good luck with. All I ever do is rinse with hot water and let air dry. Before I start brewing I always take a look inside the bucket and I like to pay particular attention to the rims and the seals. I rinse the seals agains with hot water just before I clamp em on. For the airlock, I always use the absolute thinnest glance of petroleum jelly. I mean like enough to coat a toothpick tip. Just so it doesnt stick.
My dad is a bilogist ( who gave the seal of approval to the gerber wash this weekend and looked at me funny about the tomato paste, but then bightened up about it.) and he said that 9 times out of ten, a culture got ruined because of stuff on the rim of the petri dishes, so I just have always been careful. Just like canning, if you get anything on the rim, it will weaken the seal.

Never use soap. Never use anything abrasive. Those plastic scour pads are about as rough as I get. Hot water and a little elbow grease for caked on stuff.
For bottles and such, if you dont have a rinse machine, then fill with 1/4 hot water shake , empty and put in the dishwasher. Fill the racks and use the "hot water wash and heated drying settings" and NO SOAP. Since I use vinegar for a rinse agent ( white vinegar works really well) they always come out squeaky clean.

[FLASH]

i highly recommend a product called starsan. ive used it for sanitizer in my homebrew beer equipment for along time and its even reuseable as long as u watch the ph.availible at most homebrew stores or online.it never has effected flavor wen used in right dosage.i love the stuff never went back to sodium metabisulfite a 5min soak generally duz the trick plus keep sum in spray bottle for touch up sanitizing.they say it no rinse but i still do.phosphoric acid based (stuff used in soft drinks)

[Cornbread]

Read an article in my new Science News magazine last night. This Lab Doc said the best way to clean any vegetable or any pot & pan,to get rid of ALL bacteria, is not bleach, but after you wash, spray with a bottle of over-the-counter hydrogen peroxide and spray with a another bottle of white vinegar....in any order. No rinse necessary. (of course I guess I would rinse with bateria laden water just to make ME feel better.) Anyway, looking at his figures, he did prove it better & safer than bleach !

[Usge]

I use bleach on some stuff, like utility 5 gal buckets for hauling water, etc., but I also use Starsan for my fermenters, barrels, airlocks, and siphon equipment, etc. It has a premeasure built into the pouring spout for use with 5 gal of water. it only takes a few mins of contact time and, as mentioned, I also rinse it despite the fact that you don't have to, and it leaves no off tastes (I used it to rinse my bottles just prior to capping some beer in them. Didn't notice any after tastes or ill effects from it at all. And that was with "no rinse" as manf suggested using it.)

[rumlover]

I have several post-mix soda machines that I to maintain. The Pepsi guys recommend sodium bisulphite. And if my memory is correct I used to in home brewing back some 20 years ago.