the penny whistle experiment

[Mr.Spooky]

soon, (but not soon enough) ill be building a flute! this plated column will be a bit smaller that the origional Magic Flute, so i thought a good name would be "the penny whistle" . my plans are to have both condensors to come off the column as one unit so i can remove the top of the rig and have removeable plates, thus, allowing me to use a gin basket, or just running wide open as a pot still. i know that there are a few flutes in the makin right now, and i think that this would be a great time to jump on board and learn as much as i can from everyone.
this is what i plan on doing, but i wanted to put it on the board for a while and get as many opinions and ideas as possible before i go too far. all opinions and sudjestions are welcome.
i submit before the pannel ,,,,,,,,,,, "The Penny Whistle"

[olddog]

Apart from the lack of cooling controls, That's a Flute


OD

[Mr.Spooky]

Apart from the lack of cooling controls, That's a Flute


OD

thanks! the cooling controls i just BS'd my way through. i have looked at yours, but i dont fully get it,,,,, yet. aside from them not being right is 1/2" a diecent size for the volume?
thanks
spooky

[Mr.Spooky]

Apart from the lack of cooling controls, That's a Flute


OD

O.D,,, it seems on the flute, you are controlling the flow of water through your deflag by the exit port. is this right?

[rednose]

Your dephlamator design is NOT enough efficient if you want to work with a plated column.

Just a tube of 1/3 of your column diameter will NOT do the job.

You need as much as possible superficial to make it a real dephlagmator, but it's your money.

Joe

[Mr.Spooky]

Your dephlamator design is NOT enough efficient if you want to work with a plated column.

Just a tube of 1/3 of your column diameter will NOT do the job.

You need as much as possible superficial to make it a real dephlagmator, but it's your money.

Joe

hey joe, thanks for the comment! im not sure what your saying. mabe it was the way that i labeled it,,, there will be a 5" tall piece of 4" copper inbetween the two reducers . not the total delphlag size being 5". is this what your talking about? if not , please explain. i domt wanna F up!
thanks
spook

[rednose]

I'm sorry if I wasn't clear enough spooky.

Let me try again, you draw as a inner dephlagmator a straight tube with the diameter of 1/3 of the total column diameter.

You want more superficil in your inner dephlagmeter to have a more coolant area as possible, you can reach that with a wider diameter and/or cooling rips (rips will make it moe complicated).

I draw a wider chamber in your draft just as an example.

Let me know if it's clear now, please.

[WalkingWolf]

Joe -- The drawing was not to scale as he will have 2" inside of 4". Looking at the drawing one could decipher that possibly the inner is actually smaller than it really is. Your point can be taken for a more efficient (allbeit more complicated and expensive) dephlag would be to expand to 3" inside of 4" for the dephlag. Interesting discussion.

Hey Spooky -- I think running two units side-by-side like that would be WAY cool.

ww

[rad14701]

Where can I get a copy of that #2 Lead drafting program...??? My BevNap Sketch program is showing its age...

[Mr.Spooky]

I'm sorry if I wasn't clear enough spooky.

Let me try again, you draw as a inner dephlagmator a straight tube with the diameter of 1/3 of the total column diameter.

You want more superficil in your inner dephlagmeter to have a more coolant area as possible, you can reach that with a wider diameter and/or cooling rips (rips will make it moe complicated).

I draw a wider chamber in your draft just as an example.

Let me know if it's clear now, please.

spooky.gif

i understand completelly, thanks. maby it was my state of the art #2 drafting program that threw you off RedNose as you can see Rad, with the #2 drafting program, you can also do virtual 2D the high tech program even threw off Walking Wolf!
sorry for the confusion,, it so hard being beyond your time.

[WalkingWolf]

You mean you do not intend to run stereoisomeric twins.

You may be on to something with the stereoisomeric units - you could theoretically run two different products from the same wash and who knows what possibilities this could present.

WARNING: What you are about to read bears no relevance to home distillation theory and should not be attempted in the comfort of your own homes. (rental properties not withstanding)

Upon further research: General Characteristics
Isomers have the same number of atoms of each element in them and the same atomic weight but differ in other properties. For example, there are two compounds with the molecular formula C2H6O. One is ethanol (also called ethyl alcohol), CH3CH2OH, a colorless liquid alcohol; the other is dimethyl ether, CH3OCH3, a colorless gaseous ether. Among their different properties, ethanol has a boiling point of 78.5°C and a freezing point of −117°C; dimethyl ether has a boiling point of −25°C and a freezing point of −138°C. Ethanol and dimethyl ether are isomers because they differ in the way the atoms are joined together in their molecules:

Isomers are classified as structural isomers, which have the same number of atoms of each element and molecular weight but different bonding patterns (see chemical bond), or as stereoisomers, which have the same number of atoms of each element, molecular weight, and bonding pattern but in which the atoms have different spatial relationships.

It has been determined that collection would be an utter impossibilty due to the extreme environmental conditions required for dimethyl ether collection.

Sorry Spooky. Such is the way of a pioneering spirit. Gotta squeeze a lot'a lemons to make lemon-ade.

[Mr.Spooky]

finally getting a few things together. with the flute builds going on right now and the different threads pertaining to plated columns, im not gonna do a detailed build log because that would be like beating a sore dick. but where i am going to get detailed, is when i get to the part of the removeable plates, because i would like any and all sudgestions/comments. anyway,,,, weres where i am.
spooky

[Mr.Spooky]

just got a prompt from Ebay to leave a comment on the plate material that i bought. i thought , what the hell, i havent even got it yet, and there wanting to get rated. sooooo i checked the tracking # and it said that it was delivered to the primary billing address,,,,,,,,,,,,, in knoxville tn. ..... looks like somebody got some free copper, and i gotta buy some more.
a swift kick in the nuts is in order
spooky

[LWTCS]

Gotta sneek in at the last possible minute and out bid.

[olddog]

The build is looking good Spooky, I made my plates from some 2"tube flattened out, that will give you more than enough for a 4"plate.


OD

[Samohon]

Hey Spook, why not use 2 or 3 x 6mm SS rods, nuts and washers, to aid in rigidity...
Just priced some of this and its quite cheap.

I think it would cetainly add regidity making the whole plate assembly easy to remove and install...

Just a thought man...

Heres a quick mock-up...

[olddog]

It may not need the centre tube with the rods in place to hold the plates.


OD

[rednose]

Right OD, the center tube is good for nothing if you use the 6mm rods, that's the way I mounted my plates.

Joe

[Samohon]

Is the center tube not needed for thermal transfer of temps guys...

Just clarifying...

[olddog]

The center tube is just a simple means of suspending the plates.


OD

[Samohon]

The center tube is just a simple means of suspending the plates.


OD

10/4 OD, I think I'll probably go the Stainless rod method. Just wondering if there's any advantage to removing the plate, apart from cleaning that is.
I think maybe it would help to make the still easy to dismantle should the need arise...

Thanks again man...

[olddog]

My plate assembly is a permanent fixture, I clean the flute by hosing it through the flange fitting on the base of the column, the Graham condenser is also removed and cleaned the same way. The only reason to be able to remove the assembly would be if you wanted to add or reduce the number of plates.


OD

[Mr.Spooky]

The center tube is just a simple means of suspending the plates.


OD

10/4 OD, I think I'll probably go the Stainless rod method. Just wondering if there's any advantage to removing the plate, apart from cleaning that is.
I think maybe it would help to make the still easy to dismantle should the need arise...

Thanks again man...

thats a good idea about the rods. something like that might be added if all the stuff is flimsy. im running 1/2" for the center tube, so i was hoping that that would make it more ridged.
about half way through today,, i was wandering if removeing the plates was really worth it. the easy flange on the delphlag was a P.I.T.A!!!
but the main reason i was wanting a removeable system was what rednose had said before about how he ran 2 plates for whiskeys and the whole set for neutrals. (i think he said that anyway). ill have 4 plates in the beginning,, then ill make a set with just 2. i can also use the "hanging system" to hang a gin basket from, or just take everything out and have a simple potstill.
any way,,, heres the detachable deflag........ i got some prettying up to do on it.
spooky

[Mr.Spooky]

The build is looking good Spooky, I made my plates from some 2"tube flattened out, that will give you more than enough for a 4"plate.


OD

im going to call the person we rented from in tn to see if a big IF the renters were nice enough to say something about it.
im a dumb ass.

[olddog]

Looking good Spooky. To run this column in potstill mode, all you have to do is to turn off the dephlagmater and just run with the Graham condenser, without refluxing the column, I designed it this way with the cooling manifold for this purpose.



OD

[Mr.Spooky]

Looking good Spooky. To run this column in potstill mode, all you have to do is to turn off the dephlagmater and just run with the Graham condenser, without refluxing the column, I designed it this way with the cooling manifold for this purpose.



OD

hmmmmmmm,,,, i was under the impression that each plate was like a mini thumper. did i miss something??????
thanks Spooky

[olddog]

i was under the impression that each plate was like a mini thumper. did i miss something????

That is correct in principle, but without the reflux action from the dephlagmater, the column will not stack the vapor.


OD

[Mr.Spooky]

i see. well, it aint over yet. it may turn out to be a dedicated plated column depending on how hard it is to get the sight glasses flush with the inside of the column so the plates can pass.
spook

[Kentucky shinner]

What did you use to make your flange on the Delphag and the top of your column.. Looking good spooky..

[Kentucky shinner]

I think the 1/2" down the middle will stiffen it up pretty good.