I want to get in to distilling and have been reading around for a few days, but I'm getting a little lost in choosing the type of still I need. I will probably buy, since my wife said I could.......
I want to distill higher flavor spirits - bourbon, rye, whisky - so, from what I understand, I do not want a refracting still. I also think, from reading, that the taller the vapor cone the better? Lastly, copper is good for many reasons. I'd like to use 2-5 gallon barrels. So, given those possibly correct assumptions, which of these types if stills would work best for me?
I've taken these pics from manufacturers websites, but I'm only asking about the design. If you have a suggestion on a manufacturer, I'd be glad to hear it.
I think I should side step this question.. You know which one I would choose
The colonel Makes some might fine stills though.. you just have to decide what you want to make.. and how much you want to spend. I am sure you will get many very good answers for very qualified folks here. These are all very nice designs and unique in there own way. Choose wisely.
ks
Kentucky shinner wrote:I think I should side step this question.. You know which one I would choose
The colonel Makes some might fine stills though.. you just have to decide what you want to make.. and how much you want to spend. I am sure you will get many very good answers for very qualified folks here. These are all very nice designs and unique in there own way. Choose wisely.
ks
No, you are absolutely welcome to give your opinion. I got the link for the Flute from your signature after all.
They all have advantages and disadvantages - the Col makes nice looking stuff, but has a 9 month lead time. The Flute is more expensive, but looks to be more versatile, etc.
I would read through the Flute talk thread. Yes its long but there is a lot of good info in there. I think it would help you decide. And get a grasp on how they work. If I had the funds I would have one already. But do research on all the types your are looking at.
Decide things like how much time you want to dedicate to running your investment. All at once or multiple runs. At what ABV you want to take it off at. Then decide which one of them you think suits you. Using the research to compare these things. And there is plenty of info around HD on these stills or AF least the style of stills.
Texas, I've used the Colonel's stills. If you look closely...most of them are CM type design hybrid/reflux. You "can" run them without the cooling tubes through the head...if...you make your own liebig and attach it to the end (or order an additional secondary liebig from him). I'm not taking anything away from the Colonel (I have 2 of them!) His stills are built like tanks!! And they are absolutely works of art in form. But, in function...I think there might be better choices ..particularly for the money and I'll explain why.
First...you gonna want something in the 15-25gal range. If you single run (or decide later you prefer the flavor of single run over double), you gonna want to stick to the higher side of that. Second is...changing out heads with a tri-clamp is a LOT easier and less expensive proposition than buying new stills. Unless you custom order your Colonels still with multiple heads, your pretty much stuck with what you initially buy/get. He won't make you a new one because each pot is hand fitted. You then run them the way they are built. But, if you got a keg or a kettle that has ferrule/tri-clamp on it...you can "easily" build, OR buy, new heads for it that use standard ferrule/tri-clamp. And in that particular regard...Bob's ur uncle. Colonel also makes wide-mouth "bottleneck" stills..that uses standard 2" pipe thread connection on the top of the cap (ie., you could build your own heads using standard 2" copper parts and attach them that way).
As far as an investment goes, you'll want the most flexibility/options from your setup without having to buy an entirely new still every time you reach some road block with one or want to take things in a somewhat different direction (although you "can" do that if you want..it's VERY expensive and takes up a lot of room compared to one pot..and multiple heads). You "can" piece together several stills or items from the colonel to give you more flexibility. But, if you are just getting started....I'd say...maybe you might want to start out with something not quite the investment to gain some experience and find out what you like (or not) first...before spending that kind of money up front.
Complete packages from brewhaus or mile-hi are quite popular and include everything you need (including packing, hoses, etc) to get started. This would be a minimal investment (by comparison) and you wont' have to wait long for it. The CM design they use is similar to most of the Colonel's heads in regards to function...although the brewhaus/mile-hi designs have been updated to at least move the cooling to the top of the column where it is more effective/modern design than what the Colonel is still using (ie.cooling tubes integrated with liebig through bottom and top of column). You could run those heads for a year or so gaining experience in basic potstilling as well as basic reflux principals while deciding what you like and don't like before investing more money. Focus on fermentation, mashes, etc. At the end of that...you'll be in a MUCH better position to make this kind of decision about spending considerably more money/investment in a given direction. I can't emphasize this enough....when I started out..I had a LOT of misconceptions about how things were gonna work. And I wasted a lot of money and time buying things I didn't need, things that didn't work, etc. The main point is, there are some things you just aren't going to know until you gain some experience. Think of it like a table with a lot of dishes/plates of food on it you've never seen before. This is no different. Some people here like slow single runs. Some like double runs. Some like single runs with reflux to clean it. Some like detuned reflux. Some like neutral..and nothing but.
If you have the money, another option that you can build on would be to buy the same 25gal optioned pot the flute comes with, plus a basic potstill head. Get that going, then add a CM head and learn how to run that. (or you could buy both heads same time) You'll have something you can gain experience on for less cost up front than buying Colonel or a Flute. Then you could add a flute head later, and/or build your own at that point... and you'd end up with a premium 25 gal pot with different heads....just unbolt one...clamp the other one on. The cost would be spread out more, and it would give you time to decide whats working and/or not working for you. Another option would be to get a keg, remove sanke valve and use that for base/pot to the various heads. Finally, I'd be remiss not to mention...just how heavy 20 gals of water/liquid is!! If you are looking for this size...you gonna need to think about the logistics of things beforehand. 20 gals of liquid is HEAVY. You aren't going to be moving that without help and/or draining it first. And where are you going to drain it? You get the picture. Anyway...just some random thoughts.
I'm not sure I'd ever call those random thoughts. Wow. Thanks for putting the time into this response - it really made a lot of sense.
To be honest, I was probably attracted to the Colonel's stills because of their looks. They "look" like a still. But, your options definitely seem to be more reasonable.
A couple of questions - 1) what is CM? and 2) why do you say I'd want a 15-25 gal still?
Texas Jim, I have a bubble cap flute. She was pricey but well worth it. Cuts my stillin time in half, product is smoother, cleaner, more flavorful and all around just better. Even my cousin is now bringing over his washes to run them on my rig. But that being said i had a basic triclamp potstill and did good things. But I love what I have now! No way would i go back unless I was forced to.
Texas Jim wrote:A couple of questions - 1) what is CM? and 2) why do you say I'd want a 15-25 gal still?
Texas Jim, head on over to the New Distiller Reading Lounge and have a good read... There is plenty of useful information there, some of which is compulsory reading, including the differences between the types of still designs we most commonly discuss here in these forums...
Here's one hint... CM stands for Cooling Management... What that means and why it is important you'll have to research...
The short of it there Tex is...CM stands for cooling management reflux. It uses the coolant water...to route through the column/head to cool it for reflux. As they said..you can read more about it (and I recommend that) elsewhere. You'll want a larger pot because you can always run "less" than a full charge, but you can't run more than what you got room for. Also, you can't "fill" the still..you have to always leave some head room for foam, etc. So, whatever your volume is you start with...you'll be loading "less' than that in there (about 3/4). Plus, if you reflux (such as a flute, or CM or etc.) on a single run wash...your gonna want/need some extra room there to keep your yields up (how much you get back). There's only so much alc in a wash/mash. You concentrate that to less volume when you distill it. Common starting out to believe that a 5 gal pot makes 5 gallons of liquor. Don't work that way. Still don't
make" alcohol. Fermentation does that. Still just extracts it at varying degrees of efficiency. You might get a gallon back off 5 gal, and you won't be keepin all that. The higher proof you run, the less you'll get back. (think of it like a sauce cooking down/concentrating).
It's fine to run less volume if you don't have space or if not able. I run a 7.5 gal brewhaus pot...with 5 gals in it..cause that's all I can physically handle inside. Yeilds on that are fine when I double run...but not too great when I try to single run something. YMMV. Above all, be safe.
Last edited by Usge on Sun May 01, 2011 8:46 am, edited 1 time in total.
Usge wrote:....Plus, if you reflux (such as a flute, or CM or etc.)............
Ok, I'm a little confused here - you say that a flute is a reflux still, but I thought that reflux stills gave product that was higher in abv and lower in flavor. But the first line in the flute thread - "Its now six months since I built the original Magic Flute, it has been a spectacular build for me, giving a consistant 90ABV with a single run, potstill takeoff speeds, and retaining full flavor, and once heads and forshots are taken, will retain 90ABV until all hearts are taken." - seems to indicate that full flavor is available from the flute (a reflux still).
Argh. I'm slogging my way through the novice thread, but there's a lot there.
Texas Jim wrote:
Ok, I'm a little confused here - you say that a flute is a reflux still, but I thought that reflux stills gave product that was higher in abv and lower in flavor.
the beauty of a rig like that is you turn the reflux up high till the heads are compressed and removed, then you lower your reflux ratio, increase your heat a little and you can push more flavor through, without being contaminated by the heads. its the best of both worlds really.
potstill like results with increased hearts volume.
I'll tell you what I would do. I would buy a keg, 75 dollars on the outside. then I would buy Kentucky Shiners cheep pot still head, what is that 120 bucks? Then a cheep gas burner 50 dollars. Your into it 250 bucks and it will make fantastic booze and do every thing your looking for.
I wouldn't suggest you spend 1200 dollars on your first rig when you don't really know what you want. Go cheep and in a year when you know what your doing spend some money but for now go cheep. It's not the rig that that makes good booze, it's the guy running it.
Ideas are like rabbits. You get a couple and learn how to handle them, and pretty soon you have a dozen. John Steinbeck
I would highly recommend building your own still I am just about done with my 1st build a 2" copper boka head on top of a 48" tall packed column .. next step is to get my SS ferruls brazed on the boka and the top of the column... then it is on to winding my condenser coil for the top of the Boka head ..still trying to decide on a dbl wound or a cold finger.
I am also gonna research on how to make myself a pot still head for the top of it For me researching on how to make these wonderful contraptions has helped me understand the principles of distilling more than reading alone did.
The cost so far has been pretty low for me I was given a sanke beer keg by a buddy and 5" of 2" copper too(altho cleaning this was a pain as it was a drain line on an industrial air unit for probably 40yrs)
most of what you need can be found on craigslist or through friends possibly if you live in a high pop area... also if you live in N Texas Brewhaus for America is located in Keller just north of Fort Worth and you can go to that candy store and save some $ on shipping
Also as others have mentioned I think it would be best for you to hit the new distillers lounge and do a lil reading it will to be honest only make you ask more questions but it will help you narrow your focus.
I think my advice could be summed up this way: If you gonna spend money (or focus) on one thing in particular...do it on the pot/keg/kettle. You can always add/build/buy a different head later. I like RD's advice...start simple...with a potstill head. Run that a while...then add/swap different heads/types later as you gain more experience. As I said before..I'd find something in the 15-25 gal range (standard keg is 15).
