uncle jesse's simple sour mash method

[marshrunner757]

Waylyn, I think if reread Rad's post a few times you will get it. I think what he's saying is to bypass the reflux completely run it fairly hard and collect down to about 30%ABV. (Stripping Run). Once you make 2-3 runs like this, you combine them, cut to 40%ABV and make a nice slow spirit run. I'm just starting myself. Rad is a wealth of information.

[waylyn]

Thanks for reply Marshrunner, you are right Rad is a wealth of information and has helped me out in the past, I will be having some time off over the christmas period so I will be home for over a week I will be able to read up on how to rum my still in pot mode etc. Here is what I am using, very happy with it especially since the intoroduction of a phase angle controller, but as you say it's all about reading.

[agooga]

Waylyn-- I got your PM and tried to reply, but your PM seems to be disabled. So here are some of my thoughts on running your rig in pot mode. Looking at your rig, you have a BIG reflux column attached. Consider removing or shortening this column. The shorter it is, the less reflux your going to get. Your always going to get some, even with no column at all, but obviously, the more reflux, the less of the mash's essence is allowed to pass through.

I can't say how much to reduce your reflux column-- this whole thing is an art that is personal to your still, your mash, your conditions, etc. But personally, I'd probably build a really simple substitute column that I could swap on to the pot part of your still-- it looks like you can take the existing one off already. Have two-- one for full reflux and one for "limited reflux" mode. Or try using no column at all-- just put a nipple on the pot with a condenser coil going into a slobber box, or cooler, or stright into your catch bottle if it's long enough to bring the vapors back to liquid.

The trick, as you know, when running pot mode is the cuts. With reflux it hardly matters. I found with my rig, that it was actually running kind of half-reflux / half-pot because I was using the full reflux column just without any of the packings inside it-- but this made a BIG difference. It's a pretty big-diameter column and not too tall to begin with, so the reflux effect was fairly reduced, but not eliminated-- and I found it produced some mighty tasty likker which I liked.

But as I said, watch those cuts and be VERY choosy! When you're learning or making changes, have LOTS of small catch bottles, numbered, and take little bits of the run and judge each one until you know which part of your run is the hearts.

Good luck!

[rad14701]

I have conversed with waylyn, at length, via PM's, regarding his rig... At this point I see no need in further drifting off topic here... Any further discussion would be best served in its own topic...

[waylyn]

agooga thanks for your reply,as rad says we had a chat on this earlier, I now understand what I need to do there was some confusion as to which still I was running but now all is crystal looking forwad to getting on with it. But thanks to all who offer support it is much appreciated

[marshrunner757]

Very nice looking still! Sounds like you're getting lined out.

[waylyn]

It's a cracker, but the operator needs a bit of tweeking( me that is )

[Odin]

Just stripped my first All Grain. 80% corn, 20% peated barley malt. I used the spend grains to start up a new gen of UJSSM. I simply put the yeast & grain bed over in another fermentor, added 25 liters of water and 4.5 kilo's of sugar. Well mixed off course. It is bubblin' like hell and giving of a great smell! (just practicing my poetry here)

Odin.

[Fastill]

Just stripped my first All Grain. 80% corn, 20% peated barley malt. I used the spend grains to start up a new gen of UJSSM. I simply put the yeast & grain bed over in another fermentor, added 25 liters of water and 4.5 kilo's of sugar. Well mixed off course. It is bubblin' like hell and giving of a great smell! (just practicing my poetry here)

Odin.

No spent beer from your boiler?? That's where lots of the flavor is at..

[Odin]

Yeah, some 25% of backset as well, actually!

[waylyn]

I'm going to experiment with mixing grains, very happy with what I've got but be nice to play with the recipes.

[Odin]

Just strippin' my first UJ in some time. Based on spend grains & yeast bed from an All Grain. MG! Even the strip run tastes good! Some good faux whiskey hidden in there. I hope I have time to do the spirit run before Xmass holidays.

Odin.

[waylyn]

I'll have around 36 ltrs around 60-70% to distill over christmas to put into my barrel

[Odin]

Shit, I am jealous!

[Odin]

But ... I just stripped and got me 6 liters of 36% low wines. Most of it smelling great when it came out of the distiller. I really want to do the spirit run. Flaked corn rules!

Odin.

[waylyn]

Doing a final strip run tomorrow, then it's the big one for me can't wait getting exited now I have some time to do my first proper run for my barrel

[Wavfact]

When I first started in this hobby, I read this forum but didn't think using just cracked corn would give me the taste I wanted so I have experimented with just about every sour mash recipe I could find and made a few of my own up. Then I finaly decided to try this since I had 50lbs of cracked corn on hand. I put about 4" into my fermenter, 10lbs sugar, couple teaspoons of nutrient and used distillers yeast.. Was quite impressed with the first run! OMG!! Used the backset, 10lbs more sugar are some nutrient for the second gen. Scrapped off about 2" pf spent grains and replaced with new. Ran that and got another impressive run from it on my pot still! I have the 3rd gen fermenting right now and hope to run it Saturday.. AWESOME recipe!

I get my KS 4 plate flute tower in about 2 weeks so will have to break the cycle and start over, can't wait though! I struggled with my thoughts about how to ferment for the 26 gallon boiler.. I decided to use 5 or 6 6.5 gallon bucket primaries rather than anything larger. Mostly because of the weight. In order to rack it, I usualy lift the bucket onto the counter in my basement so I have a good siphon going. If I used a 16.5 gallon or a 32 gallon primary, I would have to dream up some sort of pump system for racking. As it is, not sure how I'll get the backset out of the boiler since the drain is at the bottom of a 26 gallon stainless steel milk can! I'm use to pulling the top off my still just after a run and invert the sugar, then let it cool down to pitching temps. Won't be the case with the KS rig...

[Odin]

W,

I understand what you are saying. I think about the same. Right now, I have a few 6.5 gallons fermenters, a 10 gallon fermenter and a 20 gallon. But those bigger ones are so difficult to work with!

Great your UJSSM is working so good! Mine did not. Well, not with the poor quality of cracked corn we have over here. The flaked corn from Hungary I use right now proves to be much, much better.

Odin.

[waylyn]

Ok guys, got myself 68ltrs of this UJSSMM, at 38% ABV this is my first big run it's already in my still going to run it tomorrow has anyone ever done a large batch that could give me some advise as to what I should expect as an end result of 62-65% for ageing in the barrel, and is there a start point and end point in abv that I should follow, sound a bit vague I know but don't want to ruin this amount od liquer I will be running in pot mode to get more flavour

[rad14701]

Ok guys, got myself 68ltrs of this UJSSMM, at 38% ABV this is my first big run it's already in my still going to run it tomorrow has anyone ever done a large batch that could give me some advise as to what I should expect as an end result of 62-65% for ageing in the barrel, and is there a start point and end point in abv that I should follow, sound a bit vague I know but don't want to ruin this amount od liquer I will be running in pot mode to get more flavour

Have you played with the Calculation of a Pot Still Distillation Run page...???

[waylyn]

Thanks Rad, no didnt see that calculation page, looking at it now. Cheers

[astronomical]

If I used a 16.5 gallon or a 32 gallon primary, I would have to dream up some sort of pump system for racking. As it is, not sure how I'll get the backset out of the boiler since the drain is at the bottom of a 26 gallon stainless steel milk can! ...

You could look into March pumps. The one annoying thing about March pumps is that they don't prime themselves so they need to be below the liquid level that you're pumping. KS has a stand for the 26G for a cool $100 that could help with backset. May be a height issue though. Look at homebrew sites to get a good idea of how to rig march pumps up.

[waylyn]

Well I did my first big run of this, I started with a total of 68ltrs @ 38% abv (watered down) and after it got to temp I had a total of 27 ltrs @ 77% average abv back good stuff full of flavour this is still too strong for the barrel I dont want to water too much I want to keep as much flavour as poss. I will keep this and just add more to it as I go to reduce the over all vol to 63% abv ish this took me around 8hrs from the first drop to the last plus around almost 2 hours to get it to temp. Then stopped as it started to pull out some oils, the abv was still @ 51% abv @ this stage so I knocked it off, looking at keeping the contents for another day when I can add some more of the cloudy stuff with it and see what I get out of it. The process took me just shy of 10 hours in total

[Wavfact]

Thanks astronomical, I just emailed them about the stand and see what the overall height will be. I have about 8 to 9 feet ceiling height.

[Odin]

Waylin,

I read you watered your low wines down. How do you do this? With water? Makes sence when you say "watering down". I ask this because I found that using some backset or mash to lower abv got me a better, more intense taste as compared to really watering it down with ... water.

Odin.

[waylyn]

Got myself another 42 ltrs of mash this comming Saturday so I'll add this to my cloudy oils and see what level it comes out at, I will wait until I have the right overall abv without using water, as you say it'll give a fuller flavour

[Mashy]

I think Miles had some posts on here that pertained to diluting your low wines to 30% or so for a cleaner spirit run, and better separation. The posts seemed to be pretty convincing, although I haven't tried it out on a run myself.

Diluting cleans things up well. If you read posts about running all feints you will note that guys dilute considerably before distilling. There is cloudy liquid left in the pot after distilling. ?? I do not pot still per-se but run a flute and have observed this as well.

On UJSSM you can recycle your feints into your next run but only a few times until the heads become quite concentrated. I will add the heads back in every other batch. After fourth or fifth generation I keep all tails in my final blend. It adds a lot of taste.

Watch a few videos about commercial guys doing large batch runs of all grain. You will see that they make a heads cut then collect everything down to 10%. There is heavy flavor is in the tails. That is where their grain bill shows off.

Here is a link for Calcium Carbonate food grade. Cheap and fast delivery.

http://www.dudadiesel.com


MR

Thanks for the tip on caclium carb MR. I'm hoping to go more than 6 generations with this. 7.95 for one pound CC with shipping. Nice.

[waylyn]

Thanks Mashy, nice link for the calcium carbonate. Cheers

[Odin]

My experience with CC is good. You don't "salt" your backset, but do up you PH. I don't think it is needed with a 25% backset percentage (given the high PH of tap water), but from 50% upward I do compensate with some CC. Which means: most of the time when I make UJSSM, because I found that upping the backset percentage of my next wash gives more/better taste.

[Mashy]

@odin

Yeah, I usually use 2 to 2 1/2 gallons per 6.5 gallon fermenter. I think I usually have about 25 liters/5.2 gallon in there. After a while the UJSM gets pretty slow. How much CC do you use per bucket generally? I know I could measure the ph etc but was hoping there was a lazier way like "toss in one teaspoon per 5 gallons and that should do it". My tap water ph is 5.5 - 5.7 here here in the "It's the water" city, so it doesn't help much with reducing PH, although it is nice when starting a an AG as I don't need chemicals, just some gypsum.