uncle jesse's simple sour mash method

[Odin]

What kinda rigg you using? What ABV was the 600 mls of hearts?

[Ghost]

Pot still, the 600 mls was about 110 proof.

[stinkypete]

hey guys im starting a fresh batch of good ol ujssm over the xmas break i lost my first wash that went a fair few gens , i used bakers yeast last time , and my product which i gaurd closely now is very good , i was just wondering if the following yeast is ok to start the whole wash off with "prestige wheat vodka yeast" ingredients are listed as active dried yeast , yeast nutrients , amyloglucosidase , trace vitamins and minerals .

im hoping its not anyway a turbo yeast as i have just used it , i plan to use all my collect as feints for next sour mash run .

thoughts on the yeast if possible please guys

regards stinky

[Odin]

That looks like a package made especially to produce a neutral product. I wouldn't use it on UJ's, maybe on a neutral, eventhough I know Birdwatcher's and expect Wineo's plain sugar wash to do a good job in that department.

[stinkypete]

thanks i only put in 2 tablespoons , maybe put a few tablespoons of the bakers yeast ?

[Odin]

You can put in additional baker's yeast, but why should you? If you keep the grain & yeast bed in place in your fermenter, you don't have to add new yeast everytime. The yeast seems to be developing over generations and for me they just seem to get better and better at fermenting what you give them. Or is this your first wash? In any case: no harm done.

[stinkypete]

yes i am starting again, 1st gen with no backset my first ujssm has been aging nearly 5 months on toasted oak sticks and already very nice drop .

[Odin]

Congrats on that, Pete!

[stinkypete]

checked thismorning and all bubbling away nicely i have two buckets with 20 l in them one i used bakers yeast the other the prestige vodka wheat yeast

[Uncle Jesse]

checked thismorning and all bubbling away nicely i have two buckets with 20 l in them one i used bakers yeast the other the prestige vodka wheat yeast

Just for the record, I always use baker's yeast.

[louddakota]

I started a 20l mash Sunday, and this is my first time making this mash. Its been going great but I get home and check it, the whole top is covered in a white foam like substance.I checked the sg and its 1.030. Also the mash doesn't smell very nice. Is this normal. Its only day 2

[stinkypete]

do you think it will have a different taste in the final product ? I usual use bakers yeast also and find it very reliable i was just experimenting i suppose cheers

[Uncle Jesse]

I started a 20l mash Sunday, and this is my first time making this mash. Its been going great but I get home and check it, the whole top is covered in a white foam like substance.I checked the sg and its 1.030. Also the mash doesn't smell very nice. Is this normal. Its only day 2

White foam.. do you mean the "spider webs"? If so, you've gone into secondary fermentation and your mash has to be tossed.

http://homedistiller.org/forum/viewtopi ... 39&t=20820

[louddakota]

No spiderwebs thank goodness! It seems to be doing fine. I'm allmost on day 5 tho and the air lock.is still bubbling .. sg is at 1.010

[Odin]

I think my UJSSM will improve from using sugar corn or sweet corn as it is called here. Turns out all the other corns are not the sweet/sugar type. I think the sugar type will help, because it certainly smells like what I do smell in Jim Beam or JD and what is missing in my UJSSM so far. Or at least: what is not there enough: omnipresence of corn flavour & smell.

I just started up a generation where I put in some 350 grams of sugar / sweet corn. Cooked. Like what you can buy here canned & for human consumption (in salads for example). Because the gen I run as we speak has none yet, I took the liberty of adding a can of 350 grams sugar corn right to the wash prior to my distillation run. Just to find out if I get over some of the taste I am after.

In de mean time, I started up some 100% barley UJSSM. Flaked barley. Now, that does give an increadible barley taste. It is all over the place, that smell & taste. Great! Currently it is a 52% white dog. I plan to drink it pure, unaged, unoaked. Maybe water down to 45%, because this is ... too much taste?

Now, I will not let go of this corn until I get as flavoured a drink (on the corn department) as is my barley ...

Guys from the States with success with this recipe, are there different types of corn and if so, does this "sweet / sugar corn" ring a bell?

Odin.

[Nosferatu]

Yeah, sweet corn is tasty. It's harvested before the kernels harden, so I imagine it will give you a different flavor. More info is here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sweet_corn" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" rel="nofollow

[Ghost]

I ran Gen 2 of this over the weekend, I added in almost a gallon from the first run and I must say the flavor and smell really carried over well. The is a huge difference between Gen 1 and Gen 2, again I kept very little out of this run and will recycle it back into the next one Gen 3 is done working off - which has been averaging about 3-4 days to finish up. Again I am very impressed and if you are new to the whole process and looking for something simple to work with - you gotta try this one.


Read the entire thread and make notes and adjust as you need to, dont be afraid to play around with the numbers! I am currently running two 7 gallon fermentors, Both 2nd and 3rd gens are done with a 3 parts water 2 parts backset - I will drop the backset number on Gen 4. thanks again!

[jacksenz]

This is my fourth generation of two 20 gallon runs of this. And I love it. All my friends and family do also. Its a very simple and easy to tinker with recipe. Very consistant. I can basically plan it around my work schedule from when I actually mix it up. Like everyone has said. Don't judge this off the first Gen. It gets better and better. The second was great, but the last one was near perfection. Very proud of myself for being able to make a quality drink. And I've only really been drinking it white dog. And some slightly aged on Apple Wood chips. Try it if you haven't. Thank ya Uncle Jesse!

[big cheese]

Ok this is a complete newby question but after reading and searching i just have to ask.

Do I really just dump the ingredients in my bucket in order for my first batch? I don't have to heat up the water to dissolve the sugar like in other recipes? Or heating up the water to dissolve the sugar just an understood thing? I read in the second phase you use hot backset to dissolve the sugar.

Thanks in advance.

Big Cheese

[Ghost]

I did heat mine up to dissovle the sugar but more force of habit than anything else, and yes 2nd gen on can dissolve with the hot backset. Enjoy !

[Odin]

Cheese,

Use hot water to dissolve sugar, add corn, start recipe.

Next gens: use hot backset for sugar melting and new corn swelling. Like Ghost says.

Odin.

[big cheese]

Thanks for the quick replies. I thought that was what you were supposed to do but it said follow recipe exactly and he didn't mention hot water. I was thinking that maybe the yeast could eat the sugar even if it was not dissolved. Sometimes I over think things.

Big Cheese

[Odin]

No problem Cheese,

Yeast can eat a lot of sugar, but - cold - it mite leave a nasty sorta sugar cake on the floor of your fermenter. Not the most efficient use of the sugar. And not how it was intended. At least ... my impression and interpretation.

Odin.

[yankeeclear]

Dissolving the sugar completely before fermenting will improve your yield. Inverting the sugar before fermenting will improve yield even further.

[Nosferatu]

Dissolving the sugar completely before fermenting will improve your yield. Inverting the sugar before fermenting will improve yield even further.

I inverted the sugar before my first generation. I took about half of the backset from that stripping run to dissolve the sugar for the second generation. If I just apply low-to-medium heat on my stove, will that suffice to invert the sugar? Or do I need to bring it to a full boil? I assume the backset should be acidic enough that I don't need lemon juice or cream of tartar. The second generation bubbled like crazy the first two days. Now it's maybe three or four bubbles a second on day three.

[Ghost]

All 3 gens of mine so far have finished out in four days flat. All have started within a 40 mins time frame and once they take off - man those things rock! I will let mine sit again for about a day, rack it off and let it sit for another day and then rack it off again into the keg and run it. Again I cant get over how simple this is and what a great product it turns out.


I will also add I throw about a gallon of the previouos heads/tails/ some hearts back in when I charge my boiler - diluted down to 40% of course.

[Odin]

I don't put extra effort & energy in inverting the sugar. The yeast does it for free. I guess from gen 2 onwards, when you melt new sugar in hot, sour backset, some inverting takes place allmost automatically, but I never checked.

Odin.

[rad14701]

I would only see inverting as beneficial for the first generation of sweet mash... Subsequent generations will benefit from the hot and slightly acidic backset as well as the naturally occurring enzymes in the grain bed...

[Odin]

Rad,

If you would make an estimate ... would the hot/accid backset at around 95 degrees C be enough to obtain like 100% or 75% or 50% conversion? Up until now, I liked it because of the "re using energy to melt sugar, swell new grains", but the inverting part may be a partial extra ...

Odin.

[rad14701]

Rad,

If you would make an estimate ... would the hot/accid backset at around 95 degrees C be enough to obtain like 100% or 75% or 50% conversion? Up until now, I liked it because of the "re using energy to melt sugar, swell new grains", but the inverting part may be a partial extra ...

Odin.

Any conversion of starches or inversion of sugars would not happen all at once... The take I have on this, based on various readings, is that the enzymes naturally created by the yeast and acidic effect of the backset on the corns various stages of breakdown is gradual, over the course of several generations... And the amounts of enzymes produced, backset used, and fresh corn added, is what determines how many generations the sour mash can be drawn out before performance begins to wane... I don't think the process has been studied as an exact science...