uncle jesse's simple sour mash method

[Doogie]

if you are doing a fermentation sequence like the recipe stated, why are you adding (that garbage) yeast at all? The yeast from the previous wash should still be alive and waiting on your backset (cooled), water and sugar ... no need to add more yeast.

But ditch the turbo - as you can see the 48hr claim is BS in your situation (maybe you are using too little) and is way more expensive than good ol' baker's yeast. The only thing turbo does better than bakers is putting more crap in yer likker.

[Andy Capp]

This is a total newbie question, but I've got a problem and I need some help understanding something.

I followed this recipe pretty closely and my first batch the ferment measured about 12% ABV in a 5 gallon wash. This distilled nicely into about four or five quarts ranging from 60% ABV down to about 30% ABV. I then took about 2 gallons of backset, added it to 3 fresh gallons of water and the old corn in the fermenter and I added 48 hour turbo yeast. I let this sit for about a week and when I measured the second batch, it was 10% ABV. I distilled that (and threw in the entire five quarts from the first distillation as per the instructions). This rendered about the same as the first batch more or less - that is, about 5 quarts of good whiskey ranging from 60% ABV to about 30% ABV. On to batch three. I used about 2.5 gallons of backset along with fresh corn, water, 8 lbs of sugar and another 48 hour turbo yeast. This time, after about 10 days, I measured and the ABV was down to 8%. I thought this was weird, but I distilled it anyway and this time I only got 3 quarts ranging from 55% ABV down to 26% ABV. I figured I'd done something wrong, and continued to use the backset for batch four. I thought maybe I hadn't distilled all the alcohol out of the wash and that the alcohol killed the yeast, or maybe I didn't use enough sugar. So this time I checked the backset and it registered 0% ABV. I used 2.5 gallons of it along with fresh corn, water, and 10 lbs of sugar. To that I added another 48 hour turbo yeast. After four days I checked the wash and it registered 2% ABV. I waited another day and it was the same. There was no more bubbling and everything had settled. What went wrong? Should I throw this out and start again or is there a way to save it. According to the recipe, the whiskey gets better the more times you re-use the sour mash backset so I'd like to save it if I can. Your advice is appreciated.

VegasTK

Firstly, it's important to add back some fresh water to the yeast bed straight after siphoning the wash.
Secondly, too much backset will make the wash more acidic and slow the fermentation down. Use less backset.
Thirdly, why are you adding turbo yeast? I re-read the recipe and can't find turbo yeast listed as an ingredient anywhere.You say you followed the recipe closely but i doubt you have even read the first page.
This recipe works if followed as per the recipe instructions.

[Doogie]

just picked up 80# of crack(ed) for $20 ... 2 x 25L fermenters with 22L are in progress now. Only addition I added some tomatoe paste for initial food for my yeastie beasties so they don't shit in my drink.

[Bushman]

just picked up 80# of crack(ed) for $20 ... 2 x 25L fermenters with 22L are in progress now. Only addition I added some tomatoe paste for initial food for my yeastie beasties so they don't shit in my drink.

That is a better price than I get it for!

[farchima]

Currently sipping on my 3rd generation UJSM...yes, it really does start to taste good after the 3rd batch! Will be ready to run generation 4 in about 2 days. Blended my cuts and diluted it down to 50% abv. Wife and I have been pouring a few shots into a glass mug with a little muscovado sugar and hot water. Even in its infancy this is pretty good stuff. I'm clearly going to have to start another fermentation (to have two going at once) just so I can save enough to oak and age a bit, 'cause I'll be damned if we can keep much of it around for very long before we drink it all. I'm brand new at this and have studied this site for months before I finally built my pot still with a 15.5 keg boiler and classic worm condenser in a bucket of water. Any questions I've had, I've been able to find the answers to by searching this site. The rest is really just hands-on experience, screwing things up, learning why things went wrong, taking notes then doing it better the next time.

As an experienced whiskey drinker I have to say that the few occasions where we drank A LOT more of UJSM than we normally do of some excellent store bought top-shelf whiskies, I feel surprisingly good the next day. I'll not mince words. There have been a few weekends where I drank more than I normally do and I know it's not a good idea to take one more sip. But the next day I wake up as if I only had 2 Miller Lites the night before. Is home distillation a cleaner product for some reason? It sure seems like it to me.

[Bushman]

Currently sipping on my 3rd generation UJSM...yes, it really does start to taste good after the 3rd batch! Will be ready to run generation 4 in about 2 days. Blended my cuts and diluted it down to 50% abv. Wife and I have been pouring a few shots into a glass mug with a little muscovado sugar and hot water. Even in its infancy this is pretty good stuff. I'm clearly going to have to start another fermentation (to have two going at once) just so I can save enough to oak and age a bit, 'cause I'll be damned if we can keep much of it around for very long before we drink it all. I'm brand new at this and have studied this site for months before I finally built my pot still with a 15.5 keg boiler and classic worm condenser in a bucket of water. Any questions I've had, I've been able to find the answers to by searching this site. The rest is really just hands-on experience, screwing things up, learning why things went wrong, taking notes then doing it better the next time.

As an experienced whiskey drinker I have to say that the few occasions where we drank A LOT more of UJSM than we normally do of some excellent store bought top-shelf whiskies, I feel surprisingly good the next day. I'll not mince words. There have been a few weekends where I drank more than I normally do and I know it's not a good idea to take one more sip. But the next day I wake up as if I only had 2 Miller Lites the night before. Is home distillation a cleaner product for some reason? It sure seems like it to me.

Congratulations, this thread since it is your first post should have gone in the welcome section but let me be the first to welcome you. I usually have 2 batches going and fermenting 2 times a month that way you can keep ahead of aging. Wait till you start drinking some of your stuff that has aged 6-12 months or longer!

[jmesle]

UJSSM is all I have been running so far. I've run a bunch of it too.One thing I've been meaning to ask someone is do sugar washes such as this tend to give people heartburn? I've had a few people sample my product and I have got a response from time to time that the got heartburn. I have also got this from time to time. I don't usually blame it on the liqueur though. I guess what I'm asking is it potentially in my cuts? Is it because its a sugar wash? Would an all grain do this? I've done a search but came up with nothing obvious. I just been telling people they are old and old people get heartburn.......lol.... Just Don't know if I actually believe it

One more thing I run a pot still with a thumper and usually only single run washes

[Doogie]

@jm - I think it is all booze - if I drink too much for too many days in a row I get wicked heartburn. take a break for a week and see if it disappears

[on1wheel01]

I can't say enough for this recipe. It is great you get a high yield for a low amount of $$$$$$. I have 3 20 gallon barrels going all the time. I yield 4 gallons out of each for the first run. Then take 8 gallons and double run it. I yield 4 gallons or so of 140 and then mix it down from there. Good stuff. I never have to add more yeast. From time to time I have to add a few egg shells in to get the ph right. But no biggie there.

[BoisBlancBoy]

Well just mixed up my first batch of UJSSM. So far after 4 hours my temperature, with a cheap stick on thermometer, says 81 degrees. Now I now the water was under 90 degrees. The batch is 5 gallons. I'm just surprised the temp hasn't droped more. Ambient temp is 73, is this cause of the internal action of the yeast doing its job?

[rad14701]

Well just mixed up my first batch of UJSSM. So far after 4 hours my temperature, with a cheap stick on thermometer, says 81 degrees. Now I now the water was under 90 degrees. The batch is 5 gallons. I'm just surprised the temp hasn't droped more. Ambient temp is 73, is this cause of the internal action of the yeast doing its job?

The fermentation process generates heat... That 81 degrees is actually within the optimum range for fermentation and 73 degrees would be getting to the low end to where it would slow down so you might consider wrapping the fermentation vessel in an old blanket or some other form of insulation...

[TonsOfFun]

Howdy Yall, Just wanted to give my complements to uncle Jesse on this recipe. I am a novice home distiller, and i am running a 4th gen UJSM as we speak. This is a very high quality whiskey, and very simple to make. A few weeks back we were celebrating the life of lost love one...so i brought a jar of UJSM to the party. A week after the party my mother in law calls me up after shooting pool in her league. She told me that while she is at league she always has a shot of Patron, and that after having some of the UJSM whiskey she was very unsatisfied with Patron, and that it had nothing on the UJSM!!! It puts a BIG smile on my face knowing that I have roughly 5 bucks in a batch of UJSM and it is higher quality than a 40 to 50 dollar bottle of store bought liquor Just want to say thanks to uncle jesse for sharing this recipe, and thanks to all the veterans that share their wealth of knowledge on the UJSM method.

[BoisBlancBoy]

Well just mixed up my first batch of UJSSM. So far after 4 hours my temperature, with a cheap stick on thermometer, says 81 degrees. Now I now the water was under 90 degrees. The batch is 5 gallons. I'm just surprised the temp hasn't droped more. Ambient temp is 73, is this cause of the internal action of the yeast doing its job?

The fermentation process generates heat... That 81 degrees is actually within the optimum range for fermentation and 73 degrees would be getting to the low end to where it would slow down so you might consider wrapping the fermentation vessel in an old blanket or some other form of insulation...

Thanks Rad, I'll just wrap the fermenter up with a blanket but let the airlock breathe.

[Equinsu Ocha]

I keep ending up with a taquila flavor when my likker is done when using this recipe. dont get me wrong, it still tastes great but I was wondering if this is common for this recipe or if someone might know a trick to change the flavor. could it be the water im using?

[BoisBlancBoy]

I followed the recipe to the T, just curious how much bubbling action I should expect to see in the airlock?

Any need to stir it?

[Odin]

A burb every one to two seconds? Don't stir.

Odin.

[BoisBlancBoy]

A burb every one to two seconds? Don't stir.

Odin.

It's been mixed up for about 18 hours and its burping once every 6-8 seconds. But eight hours ago it was only bubbling about every 12 seconds. So it seems it is picking up the longer its been mixed.

[Bushman]

A burb every one to two seconds? Don't stir.

Odin.

It's been mixed up for about 18 hours and its burping once every 6-8 seconds. But eight hours ago it was only bubbling about every 12 seconds. So it seems it is picking up the longer its been mixed.

Agree with Odin, airlocks are not reliable if the fermenting bucket is not sealed completely, let it go for a week and then check it.

[Odin]

Yeah, if it is sour it is done.

Odin.

[BoisBlancBoy]

It shouldn't be sour already should it, this is the first ferment?

The bucket for sure is sealed. If I pull out the airlock and put my thumb over the hole and scqueeze the bucket I can build a lot of pressure.

[Odin]

A ferment is sweet when it still has unfermented sugars in it. When the yeast is done eating the sugar, the fermentation/wash will taste sour. It gives you an indication when it is done.

The whiskey you make out of it will be a sour mash whiskey only on generation II, when you added backset back to the fermenter.

So that you don't confuse the two.

Odin.

[Jimbo]

It shouldn't be sour already should it, this is the first ferment?

The bucket for sure is sealed. If I pull out the airlock and put my thumb over the hole and scqueeze the bucket I can build a lot of pressure.

Why are you arguing with the old dogs trying to help you yes it will be sour it drops to 4 pH after fermenting which isprecisely why you add it to the next batch to help your mash convert better and buckets even withlids that snap on tight will leak slow and you can't tell by putting a finger over anything. Mine do.

[Ridgerunnr]

I have run into 5 gen of this stuff..It does go sour..noticeably so on gen 2 and so forth. Patience is the key..Mine always stopped popping in air lock after 4 days but smalled finsished about day 6. The mash would clear a little but then adn seemd truly " dead" no slight fizz noise when you put ear to it etc..and the sour smell was a bit acrid to the nose. When in doubt..wait lol .

[BoisBlancBoy]

A ferment is sweet when it still has unfermented sugars in it. When the yeast is done eating the sugar, the fermentation/wash will taste sour. It gives you an indication when it is done.

The whiskey you make out of it will be a sour mash whiskey only on generation II, when you added backset back to the fermenter.

So that you don't confuse the two.

Odin.

Thanks Odin, I got confused when you said sour meaning after the sugar was consumed. All clear now though. Got home from work today and she is bubbling about ever 4 seconds now.

[BoisBlancBoy]

Why are you arguing with the old dogs trying to help you

I wasn't arguing at all, just a little confused is all.

Not saying my bucket doesn't leak at all, but I know for a fact that the pressure I created it far more substantial that what my airlock is creating. My field of work consists of leak/pressure testing so please don't assume that I don't know what I'm talking about.

[Jimbo]

ok, well buckets leak about as slow as yeast produces Co2. In my experience. Its very frustrating cause I too would like to know when things are going, slowing or done. And just as often as not the damn shitty ass buckets are worthless in that regard. I use typical brewshop 6 gallon jobs. On the other hand I have some 20 gallon barrels Iuse for whiskey washes with clamp on lids and those babies seal up as tight as a frogs ass.

[BoisBlancBoy]

I ended up gettin on of the 32l pail from brewhaus.com. I wanted something just a bit bigger than a 5 gallon bucket since I built 7.75 gal keg.

Either way, I'm happy to see if bubbling faster.

Could there be a chance I added the yeast when the water was just a little too warm and that why it took 24 hours to get going really good?

[frozenthunderbolt]

those babies seal up as tight as a frogs ass.

That aint that tight.
Ask my gram'ma; back in the bad old days she and her friends would pop a straw in a inflate the poor beasties.

[120proof]

HA HA HA HA!!! That was funny!

[Odin]

Ouch!