Heating Element Control

[rugbytaco]

i phrased that wrong. i dont think its controlling the output. I see no changes in he boiler temps or in the output. it also stays on once i completely turn off the dimmer, like it clicks off.

[rugbytaco]

I wonder if its because my dimmer is only rated to 1000w and i have a 2000w element?

[sambedded]

I wonder if its because my dimmer is only rated to 1000w and i have a 2000w element?

Hmm.. Most likely you just killed triak at your dimmer by such overload.

[rugbytaco]

i didnt see any on mouser. for 2k volts

[rugbytaco]

would the variac below work for my 2000w element? im a plumber and i hate electricity. water and electricity dont mix
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vi ... ink:top:en" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" rel="nofollow

[Digital_Plasma]

Concerned that i might pop a fuse in my head, i havent read all 96 pages so far. So im sorry if i double post anything.
I just ordred this little gadget from DX.com. I think that might come in handy. They also have other models for 2000W whatevers that i've considered buying. Then i can controll (i think) my waterpump and other stuff.

http://dx.com/p/3800w-adjustable-0-220v ... 20v-150622" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" rel="nofollow

DP

Ps.

Im not sure which models goes for the 120V range. Sorry....

[Prairiepiss]

would the variac below work for my 2000w element? im a plumber and i hate electricity. water and electricity dont mix
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vi ... ink:top:en" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" rel="nofollow

This would work.

Something else you need to look at. A 2000w element will draw 18 amps. Most home circuits are only 15 amp circuits. You will need to run this on a 20 amp circuit. Most GFCI circuits are 20amp. But you should at least double check the circuit you are running it on.

As car as your dimmer. The dimmer doesn't carry the load of the element. The triac in the circuit does. So the 1000w rating should make no difference. Assuming you followed pints controller plans.

[rugbytaco]

thanx prairie! i didnt check the breaker to see what the outlet was running on but it never flipped. i wonder if i drop down to a 1500w element, would that give me more control seeing as its drawing less. otherwise i might just get the variac
ps i no nothing about electrical work/theory

[rugbytaco]

WW: This diagram helped. Alot. Think it was posted by pinto... cant find the thread so will repost.
http://homedistiller.org/forum/download ... &mode=view
Brew

i used this. somewhere in the thread someone stated that MT1 and MT2 were backwards. Is this diagram correct or the two reversed?

[rad14701]

WW: This diagram helped. Alot. Think it was posted by pinto... cant find the thread so will repost.
http://homedistiller.org/forum/download ... &mode=view
Brew

i used this. somewhere in the thread someone stated that MT1 and MT2 were backwards. Is this diagram correct or the two reversed?

Don't go by the diagram, go by the spec's for the Triac you are using... A 300W dimmer (600W works too) will drive any sized Triac because the load on the control circuit is minimal...

[Cmdte]

Im reading and wondering if Im planning on building the circuit for a 240v, 4500 watt heating element to use on my 50 l beer keg, using the TRIAC BTA26-700B what is the wire gauge I have to use on the circuit to wire all this, do I have to use the same wire thickness as the one on the 240v line ?

Thanks.

[rad14701]

Im reading and wondering if Im planning on building the circuit for a 240v, 4500 watt heating element to use on my 50 l beer keg, using the TRIAC BTA26-700B what is the wire gauge I have to use on the circuit to wire all this, do I have to use the same wire thickness as the one on the 240v line ?

Thanks.

Blue wires are high load... Red wires are for the control circuit and are low load so thinner wire can be used...

[Cmdte]

Im reading and wondering if Im planning on building the circuit for a 240v, 4500 watt heating element to use on my 50 l beer keg, using the TRIAC BTA26-700B what is the wire gauge I have to use on the circuit to wire all this, do I have to use the same wire thickness as the one on the 240v line ?

Thanks.

Blue wires are high load... Red wires are for the control circuit and are low load so thinner wire can be used...

Thought about that but I wasnt sure, thanks for making it clear.

[sambedded]

Im reading and wondering if Im planning on building the circuit for a 240v, 4500 watt heating element to use on my 50 l beer keg, using the TRIAC BTA26-700B what is the wire gauge I have to use on the circuit to wire all this, do I have to use the same wire thickness as the one on the 240v line ?

Thanks.

For blue and brown wires I'd recommend 12AWG wires. Red wires can be much thinner.

[Cmdte]

Im reading and wondering if Im planning on building the circuit for a 240v, 4500 watt heating element to use on my 50 l beer keg, using the TRIAC BTA26-700B what is the wire gauge I have to use on the circuit to wire all this, do I have to use the same wire thickness as the one on the 240v line ?

Thanks.

For blue and brown wires I'd recommend 12AWG wires. Red wires can be much thinner.

Alright, thanks.

[Cmdte]

Cant seem to find the ceramic capacitor, is this any good ?

http://www.ebay.ca/itm/100pcs-0-1uF-104 ... 400wt_1392" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" rel="nofollow

[sambedded]

Cant seem to find the ceramic capacitor, is this any good ?

http://www.ebay.ca/itm/100pcs-0-1uF-104 ... 400wt_1392" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" rel="nofollow

Nope, they are rated 50v but you need 400v

[Cmdte]

Cant seem to find the ceramic capacitor, is this any good ?

http://www.ebay.ca/itm/100pcs-0-1uF-104 ... 400wt_1392" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" rel="nofollow

Nope, they are rated 50v but you need 400v

Really, even if the line is getting 240v ?

Edit: The info on the capacitor doesnt seem to be right, the guy at the e-store says ''0.1 mkF @ 400volts'' mkF does not make sense. 0.1 uF or pF or nF maybe ?

[rad14701]

I received an order that had those tiny capacitors instead of what I wanted and they did not work at all for their intended purpose... I ended up sourcing my capacitors locally instead of trying to get them replaced... You want something larger in physical size, similar to the ones you see in other controller designs...

[Cmdte]

I received an order that had those tiny capacitors instead of what I wanted and they did not work at all for their intended purpose... I ended up sourcing my capacitors locally instead of trying to get them replaced... You want something larger in physical size, similar to the ones you see in other controller designs...

Yeah, I know what you mean, but I have no idea the one we see in other controller designs, can you point me inthe right direction here ? also, do I need 0.1 uf , 400 volts ? or can it be: 1.0 uf 400v ?

[rad14701]

I received an order that had those tiny capacitors instead of what I wanted and they did not work at all for their intended purpose... I ended up sourcing my capacitors locally instead of trying to get them replaced... You want something larger in physical size, similar to the ones you see in other controller designs...

Yeah, I know what you mean, but I have no idea the one we see in other controller designs, can you point me inthe right direction here ? also, do I need 0.1 uf , 400 volts ? or can it be: 1.0 uf 400v ?

It must be .1uf, NOT 1.0uf... There is quite a timing difference between the two in these circuits... For a 240V controller you should use 400V rated capacitors...

[Cmdte]

I received an order that had those tiny capacitors instead of what I wanted and they did not work at all for their intended purpose... I ended up sourcing my capacitors locally instead of trying to get them replaced... You want something larger in physical size, similar to the ones you see in other controller designs...

Yeah, I know what you mean, but I have no idea the one we see in other controller designs, can you point me inthe right direction here ? also, do I need 0.1 uf , 400 volts ? or can it be: 1.0 uf 400v ?

It must be .1uf, NOT 1.0uf... There is quite a timing difference between the two in these circuits... For a 240V controller you should use 400V rated capacitors...

Sorry to ask too many details but I just wanna be sure I order all the right components. Thanks.

[Odessit]

Cant seem to find the ceramic capacitor, is this any good ?
Nope, they are rated 50v but you need 400v

Cant seem to find the ceramic capacitor, is this any good ?
Nope, they are rated 50v but you need 400v

Ups... why 400?
Voltage at capacitor never be more then 40v because DB3 opens triac when at capacitor will be 36-38v . After opening of triac, voltage at capacitor goes to zero. Capacitor 0.1uf 50v will be good for this.

[sambedded]

You are right. 50V capacitor should be OK. My bad.

[knowledge_sponge]

In my opinion based on years of experience working with these devices you cant beat the smooth non cycling control of the (variable ac transformer) Variac TM and Auto-transformer TM are both registered trade marks (These are not variable resisters) they come in all shapes sizes phases ampacity. If you buy them new they are expensive but if you go to thrift stores surplus sales or just put the word out that you need one or some over time you will have some. I have several 15 20 and 30 amp. For heating element they are perfect you wont be adjusting them much once you got them set no cycling what so ever and you can dial temp like down town. In fact companies like DuPont in their chem labs use these specifically for there heating baskets for the reaction flasks where temp control is the utmost important. They are not good for cycling heavy loads because they are not regulated. Heavy sudden load you get a voltage drop then tries to recover. If you understand how a transformer works . it simply is the ratio number of winding between the primary and secondary in most cases around an iron core.( the size of the conductors and the size of the core define current and other particulars) but for the basic voltage step up or voltage step down is simply the ratio of winding directly. Just for learning lets say you have a transformer with 100 winding on the primary and two hundred on the secondary and the the supply voltage is 100 volts input. Well the secondary would be 200 volts out a step up. Directly proportional.
the variable ac transformer is simply a circular iron core and the primary and secondary are wound around each other. And typically the same number of wingdings for both. The difference is that the secondary winding is flattened and the vinyl coating removed and a carbon brush or wiper is attached to the knob the brush can contact winding one as you turn it winding two and so on making is whatever voltage in but completely variable from winding one to the last winding I think they are kinda cool
but the best thing for heating is there is no cycling like a stove top temp controllers or thermostat. Here are some in and out of the cases

[Stillatryin]

Gentlemen, Ive been from one end of this thread to the other. It's taken most of the day. I've made some careful notes and saved quite a bit of the info. I googled "How to build an Electric Still". THis came up and seems to be about the cheapest and most complete (for dummies like me) to fire the pot. I ran my first batch with propane and keeping the temp and flow uniform was a challenge at best. I don't think it'll be cheaper to run with propane anyway. Elements are cheap and so are the other electrical components. Cheers!
http://www.scribd.com/doc/51760792/How- ... tric-Still" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" rel="nofollow

[jholmz]

Im not an electrician and cant build by schematics i was wondering if this item would work for a 1500w element. i only have regular 110 house plugs to work with and this looks pretty good just dont know anything about heating with electric i use a turkey fryer for heat at the moment but would like to switch to electric.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Lindco-Power-Co ... 35bf8958fa" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" rel="nofollow

[Stillatryin]

Im not an electrician and cant build by schematics i was wondering if this item would work for a 1500w element. i only have regular 110 house plugs to work with and this looks pretty good just dont know anything about heating with electric i use a turkey fryer for heat at the moment but would like to switch to electric.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Lindco-Power-Co ... 35bf8958fa" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" rel="nofollow

Brother, I think 10amps as the controller is is rated falls about 500 watts short of running your element. Slap me down if I'm wrong. I'm not wise to many specifics on formulas and running stills, but amps and watt draw are pretty easy.

[Burks]

Anyone tried this method yet? I'm considering using a 1500w element on a 5 gallon SS pot. Would rather use electric instead of gas since I'm indoors.

Also, can a copper female threaded fitting just be soldered into the side of the pot to house the element?

I'm not very good with electrical stuff so I'm trying to KISS method. Otherwise I'm more worried about frying myself than making good shine. Wish I could just buy a reliable system already build!

It seems to me there may be an easier way to control your temperature , the same way most industrial machines do it ,using electronic's designed for the job

there are a wide range of digital temperature controllers available for a reasonable price
here is an example

http://www.ebay.com/itm/100V-240V-PID-D ... 4abbc1f52a" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" rel="nofollow

hook this up with a solid state relay turning your element on and off and you have precise temperature control

you can place the thermocouple where your thermometer would normally go and your still is automatic

set your parameters to preheat at a given time

has an alarm function you can use to turn on a second element if temperature is more than x-amount below desired level

if you want to get more accurate buy a unit that can set the temp to 0.1 of a deg and use a variable control SSR (4-20 ma control ) ,that way when your temperature is low element comes on at full power and as it nears it's set point it will run the element at a fraction of it's reted output power.

[maheel]

you dont want to control the temp of the boiler you want to control the POWER your putting into the boiler

if you dont want to buy the PSR-25 get one of these

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/140730716566 ... 1423.l2649" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" rel="nofollow

then
get a PC cooling fan and a 5V power supply for the fan (phone charger etc)
get a box to put it in

total cost will be about $30 max if you scrounge around

wire it up and your away